Gruppem - Civinfo

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post #1 of 37 (permalink) Old 14th February 2017, 01:31 Thread Starter
 
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Gruppem

3 types

http://www.gruppem.co.jp/news/?itemid=558
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post #2 of 37 (permalink) Old 14th February 2017, 06:25
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Originally Posted by nunoctr View Post
Looks like the most lazy design to date yet. It's just a cone filter on the end of the intake pipe.

Cheers for posting though
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post #3 of 37 (permalink) Old 15th February 2017, 13:36
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What makes it GruppeM if it's jus a K&N and using standard duct thing? Am I missing something here.
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post #4 of 37 (permalink) Old 15th February 2017, 18:18
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so we have 2 big manufacturers taking air feed from engine bay, and ..what.. just one dyno readout of 30bhp loss with such a filter?
Interesting. i'm keeping my eye on dyno threads more... £/bhp might come into the results.
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post #5 of 37 (permalink) Old 15th February 2017, 18:49
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Got excited when I read GruppeM, Not sure what they were thinking with that one
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post #6 of 37 (permalink) Old 15th February 2017, 21:15
 
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Dyno runs are usually performed with the bonnet open and with big fans blowing on the engine. Not really realistic.
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post #7 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 08:35
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Dyno runs are usually performed with the bonnet open and with big fans blowing on the engine. Not really realistic.
exactly. someone posted 30bhp loss on the injen on dyno, and now everyone is avoiding it like the plague. If it's worse with the bonnet shut, then i cant see how these things are being released from known reputable companies. maybe from a supplier on ebay, but not injen or gruppeM.

oh, i'm not saying these type of filters perform as well as ducted systems, i'm just skeptical to the claimed loss of power figures. so much so, if i had the money i'd test it myself.
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post #8 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 11:11
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Yet we have a member who said +17bhp. The injen one is confusing.
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post #9 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 11:48
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Isn't there talks over on civicturbo of the eventuri not delivering the bhp they advertised
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post #10 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 12:36
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Not seen it but it wouldn't surprise me on anything with quoted power gains as we don't know the conditions for testing.
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post #11 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 12:41
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Dyno runs are usually performed with the bonnet open and with big fans blowing on the engine. Not really realistic.
Vented bonnet?
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post #12 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 12:56 Thread Starter
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this gruppem is the "normal" one they sell, not the ram air models more expensive.

One thing you have to look is the maf housing. Gruppem knows their business on this. Look at the Fn2 model. It worked with a stock car were 99% of the other intakes didn't because of the incorrect maf housing

The first one of this M's intakes have a giant filter. Probably the biggest one I have seen on a stock car. So the only thing it needs is a cold air feed.

The stock rubber pipe is not a problem. Also eventuri intake works with it.
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post #13 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 13:06 Thread Starter
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Í forgot to say. I wil not buy it as I don't like "open" intakes.
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post #14 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 13:37
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I just likes whatever is noisy. Would love an HKS RSK level noise one.
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post #15 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 18:09 Thread Starter
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the first one should make big noise, but never as a NA car
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post #16 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 19:02
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Originally Posted by dweezle View Post
Isn't there talks over on civicturbo of the eventuri not delivering the bhp they advertised
yep. half the quoted figure. which imo is about right. I'm not sure anyone sees the gains the manufacturers claim.
thing is, as we all know there are many variables that affect performance: temp, humidity, fuel, height from sea level (air density), dyno hardware.
Someone mentioned (probably civicturbo forum) you need to run dyno of before and after mods, and reruns close as possible to keep variables as identical as possible.

quick look into things; 3% (rough rule of thumb) HP loss for every 1000ft elevation increase from sea level. for us on 306bhp thats 10 per 1000ft. EDIT < wrong info. see chris reply 2 below...

Last edited by veehexx; 17th February 2017 at 14:56.
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post #17 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 21:14
 
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Dyno runs should use corrected values, according to a standard. Otherwise you can't compare numbers.
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post #18 of 37 (permalink) Old 16th February 2017, 21:53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by veehexx View Post
height from sea level (air density)..........quick look into things; 3% (rough rule of thumb) HP loss for every 1000ft elevation increase from sea level. for us on 306bhp thats 10 per 1000ft.
The above only applies to NA

Makes no difference to a turbo car



Chris.
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post #19 of 37 (permalink) Old 17th February 2017, 16:59
 
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The above only applies to NA

Makes no difference to a turbo car



Chris.
That's not true. High elevation changes turbo behaviour as well: The short answer is that the turbo has to spool up to a higher rpm to generate the same amount of boost. Higher elevation therefore means you need higher rpm till full boost kicks in which obviously makes the car slower.

There's also a maximum RPM the turbo can spool so at higher elevation you usually loose some max boost as well because the turbo is already a max RPM but can't produce max RPM.

The loss is lower compared to natural aspirated engines but it's there nonetheless.
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post #20 of 37 (permalink) Old 17th February 2017, 17:08
 
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In the NL we have the greatest horsepower in the world, it's true. We are below sea level, it's great, it's true. 😀
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