Warranty Servicing...Warranty...don't need Honda or Honda Parts - Page 2

NEEMSTAR · 1st April 2008, 21:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by LNT

The way I think about this is that 1. If cost doesn't matter, then always go to the franchised dealer, because that way you'll always have a comeback against Honda one way or the other. 2. If cost is an issue, think about the bigger picture, when you come to sell it, not having the FHSH is a real killer. Especially if you trade in.

its not about cost - its about where you get the better service

and not neccessarily a killer if you don't have FHSH. i know if i was to buy a "performance" car i would rather it have been looked after by a specialist then a Honda dealership and i know many other people in the market for such car would agree

LNT · 1st April 2008, 22:54

Thing is Neem, for some it IS about cost, so I was only addressing that point of view for a start.

And I might possibly agree about performance cars, perhaps like a TVR or something exotic, but we're talking about mass produced vehicles which are only worth a finite amount. For mass produced cars like Hondas no one will pay more than what the CAP black book says a vehicle is worth, and a dealer (whether that be franchised or back street garage) certainly won't. And that worth will be substantially less without the dealer stamps complete. That's not my opinion, that's set in stone fact. Just look at a CAP black book to find that out. We might love our cars and want the best for it, but in the end, it's just a piece of metal and will only be worth what the book says.

If I was out to by a Civic Type R and I had a choice between a Civic TR in a dealership and one for sale privately advertised having been serviced by a "Specialist" I know which I'd go for every time. The one which won't have nosedived in value.

eyemdee · 1st April 2008, 23:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kremmen

I know it costs more but I will always used a franchised dealer to get the 'unknowns' secretly tended to.

Agreed. I just paid £165 for first service at Honda dealer and the only extra I asked for was the fuel filler cap fix. They said they needed it for around 3.5 hours and that was how long it took.

Now I know that the first service usually takes around an hour and I am guessing that the rest of the time in the workshop (and it was) was work billed to Honda for the 'unknowns' like the i-shift remap and other quality issues which are well documented here.

That stamp in the book is also worth the difference when you come to sell IMHO.

Kremmen · 2nd April 2008, 04:14

The i-shift remap is only done if you ask.

There are some items that they will do, but it has to be in the form of a complaint unfortunately. The HFT fix was another.

Having said that though my original dealer claimed no knowledge of the i-shift upgrade which does sort of put my statement into the shade if some of them are not reading or digesting the service bulletins.

Krysten CTR · 2nd April 2008, 13:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kremmen

There are some items that they will do, but it has to be in the form of a complaint unfortunately.

Honda Dealers used to do the Warranty Work on cars as they came through for Servicing, even on cars which hadn't been 'complained' about.

I personally call this the right thing to do. Take the handbrake issues. I'd rather it was done as a matter of course rather than having to wait until it didn't work one day and my CTR ended up in a ditch or worse.

Honda cottoned onto the dealers doing this and then stopped it due to the cost side of things. Now the issues on the cars have to identified and 'complained' about to the dealer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NEEMSTAR

its not about cost - its about where you get the better service

Totally agree. Cost comes into it of course, but I'd pay more for good service. Dealers don't necessarily have the best service, but then do all independants. I think it's down to who you want to deal with. Plus the dealers I know will try to match an independant's price if they can.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LNT

If I was out to by a Civic Type R and I had a choice between a Civic TR in a dealership and one for sale privately advertised having been serviced by a "Specialist" I know which I'd go for every time.

Funny that. Good Statement. We all know that if you have two virtually identical CTRs side by side at the same price and one has FHSH and the other's been serviced by the local garage, which one would you buy?? This is the same for any car, regardless of manufacturer.

eyemdee · 2nd April 2008, 18:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kremmen

The i-shift remap is only done if you ask.

Hmm. I'm not so sure as I think mine has been done. They never mentioned it and I never asked as I had no issues with the 2007 version. The shift pattern has changed and the one hesitation spot between 2nd and 1st when almost at a standstill has gone. I also think it is now marginally quicker finding 2nd from 1st on acceleration.

They certainly "remapped" the dashboard illumination which I definitely didn't ask for!

TTDegs · 3rd April 2008, 00:40

To my mind, there are 3 types of places you can take you car for work

1) Your fave Honda dealer. The downside is potentially the price (which I've covered elsewhere, and doesn't necessarily justify calling them stealers

). The upside is a guarantee of no future quibbles over if a part was of 'equal quality'. Plus the dealer stamp in the service book.
2) Your fave independant specialist. The downside is the lack of Honda stamp, and the pontential for quibble over quality of parts. May not get sent regular Honda updates. The upside is an indepth knowledge of the car, and potentially a cheaper bill (maybe).
3) The small garage at the end of the road. Upside - dead cheap. Downside - he only owns 2 spanners and a big hammer

(yes, sweeping generalisation for comedic affect

)

So. where you spend your cash is a personal choice

As to resale value...
Depends on who you are selling to!

For example. Lets say that Neemstar and LNT (sorry gents, picked you as the 2 recent vocalists

) were both in the market for a 2nd hand CTR.

Here we have, for sale, two identical CTRs.
1 has a book full of Honda stamps
1 has a book full of ABP stamps.

LNT wouldn't touch the independant CTR with a barge poll
Neemstar would however, prefer it to the Honda mantained one. And may, (I'm guessing here Neemstar, so apols if wrong!) actually have been willing to pay more for it, becuase it has been looked after by a specialist.

Pays yer money, takes yer choice

Whilst overall, I would personally go with Honda dealer on a non-CTR, if I had a CTR I would personally take the short term gain of specialist service over the long term potential loss.

Kremmen · 3rd April 2008, 07:27

or..........

buy the cheaper one and take it straight to a Honda dealer for a full service and checkup.

NEEMSTAR · 3rd April 2008, 15:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by TTDegs

Neemstar would however, prefer it to the Honda mantained one. And may, (I'm guessing here Neemstar, so apols if wrong!) actually have been willing to pay more for it, becuase it has been looked after by a specialist.

definitely!
also agree if it was a non CTR i wouldn't mind if it was a H dealer
but anything which I would class as a "performance" car i think i would rather it be looked after by a specialist
(by specialist i don't mean the guy with a 8 ft square garage down the dodgy alleyway behind aldi)

LNT · 4th April 2008, 13:51

Anyone who pays MORE for a car, than the CAP book price for a CTR, would need their head testing. We're not talking Ferrari or Lambo here, we're talking mass market hot hatch. A CTR is not a "Performance car" as such, it's merely the sporty model of a range and is mass produced. A glance at Auto Trader will show over 150 New shape 2nd hand CTRs available, so it's not as though it's a rare car, so why pay more than you need to?

If, in the event, you were daft enough to pay over the odds for a car without a full dealer history, what happens when you then want to sell on? Not only have you lost out in the first place, but you then take another massive hit. Plus, if someone has actually paid more for a "Specialist" car history, what does that say about the car in the first place? That it has probably been used to it's full potential and driven to its maximum. i.e thrashed (and if not, what's the point if it's not about the cost?) so potentially worth even less.

I'm not sure where this idea that the dealers don't know about the CTR comes from, as they are all qualified and get sent on courses for the latest models all the time. If the "Specialist" does too, that's fine, but why are they therefore better? There are plenty of petrolheads in the dealers too, and take as much pride in their work as anyone. Don't judge the mechanics by the salesman!

Perhaps Neemstar's APB Motorsport race tune CTRs for the track and so knows them inside out. In which case, it's possibly a fair shout, (although they appear to also "Specialise" in Saxo's, which is a bit of a worry) and it's possible that if that "Specialist" also sells a few CTR's he could perhaps demand more than the book price because of his race tuning reputation of the car and some people might be happy to pay it, obviously including Neemstar, but these "Specialists" are a rarity. In the end, though, if you then went to a dealer to sell it you'd still take a huge hit, and even if you took it back to the "Specialist" he'll never offer you over the book price.

I used to have a Nova GTE which was serviced by a race mechanic who's daughter was a racing driver, drove great when it was serviced, but after a while, without the constant attention a racing car needs, it's not as good and drank fuel. So taking a car for servicing at a place like that might actually end up dearer anyway because of the more frequent trips to the garage.

In the end, you pay your money and take your chance, but if a couple of years fast driving is worth losing a lot of money, then it's up to the individual. I know I've learnt my lesson the hard way.

Minkster · 4th April 2008, 15:29

I bought mine from Grantham Honda, part of the Lincolnshire Honda group - and they have something whereby they say that if you continue to get servicing from them, you receive an automatic extension to many warranty items - up to 100k miles I think

Coldwarkid · 5th April 2008, 20:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minkster

I bought mine from Grantham Honda, part of the Lincolnshire Honda group - and they have something whereby they say that if you continue to get servicing from them, you receive an automatic extension to many warranty items - up to 100k miles I think

Me too, as you long as you get it serviced in the group you also get free MOT's as long as you own it.

Who did you buy your car from at Grantham?

deeny · 6th April 2008, 12:01

i also thought or was told the independent garage as to be vat registered as well as using genuine parts? to sustain your warranty

Krysten CTR · 8th April 2008, 23:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by deeny

i also thought or was told the independent garage as to be vat registered as well as using genuine parts? to sustain your warranty

VAT reg'd is right. Shows a certain level of commitment to being a mechanic / business. And genuine parts are a must.

hgt · Yesterday, 09:29

I had my first service recently, which consisted of oil and filter change.
The oil I can buy at hafrauds for £38 and a genuine filter for £7.50 on the Internet.
The dealer charged £150 for the service, that means they charged me £104.50 for 1 hours labour.
As they get the oil and filter cheaper than I can they will have made more than £104.50.
Then they get upset when we call them Stealer's.

I will be taking my car to ABP in Crewe for its next service, their charges seem fair and reasonable.
I know we all have to make a profit but over £104 an hour for labour, come off it Stealer's.

NoNumpty · Yesterday, 09:54

They do a lot more than just change the oil

Check here
Maintenance Schedule - Civinfo Wiki

Also £150 isn't bad - checkout other peoples service costs here
Service Cost - Civinfo Wiki

Had an oil change done on mine recently and the parts came to £88 - oil for diesel is different than for petrol - they didn't charge me for labour

Holdcroft_Honda · Yesterday, 09:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by gjackson

1)The example used here is an independant that deals with CTR's day in day out. A franchised dealer may only see one or two a week in amongst the 100's of cars they work on.

We see just a few more than that. I just looked through the window and there are four in the workshop right now. lol

As most of you know, we have two Honda Master technicians on site. Together with their knowledge base, the latest manufacture information and updates, along with genuine parts on the shelf. How could we not be called a Honda specialist?

Mr JP · Yesterday, 09:59

Yeah but your a good dealer

Holdcroft_Honda · Yesterday, 10:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr JP

Yeah but your a good dealer

Maybe, and thanks. Although there are many other dealers across the country who offer the same level service.

Classic example from the week before last. I had a chap with a 07 CR-V company car come in to buy some roof bars. Whilst his car was in we checked if his car had any product updates outstanding on his car. It had.

After we had completed all the work he was telling me how the company he worked for owned 5 CR-V's, but they were maintained by an independent garage close to their office. He says he has pleaded with his boss to let the cars come to a Honda dealer for such reasons, but he is "set in his ways". So unless he had come in to us he wouldn't of known about the headlamp bulb mod, or the revised diff fluid mod which had been causing the low speed shudder from the back end. Something that had been diagnosed as a faulty drive shaft by his independent.

hgt · Yesterday, 10:29

Everything else they listed on the service report was visual checks that I can do myself in less than 5 minutes.
In fact this is another Dealer con on the public when they advertise a 80 point check etc, and all it consists of is visual checks that anybody with a couple of brain cells can do themselves.
The point I am making is, I can do exactly what the dealer did, oil change, filter change and visual checks in less than 20 minutes I am not against the dealers making a profit but let it be a fair profit, not a rip off on an unsuspecting public.

1st April 2008, 22:54	#22 (permalink)
LNT Triangular Exhaust Join Date: 24th March 2007 Location: England Posts: 220 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader: (0)	Thing is Neem, for some it IS about cost, so I was only addressing that point of view for a start. And I might possibly agree about performance cars, perhaps like a TVR or something exotic, but we're talking about mass produced vehicles which are only worth a finite amount. For mass produced cars like Hondas no one will pay more than what the CAP black book says a vehicle is worth, and a dealer (whether that be franchised or back street garage) certainly won't. And that worth will be substantially less without the dealer stamps complete. That's not my opinion, that's set in stone fact. Just look at a CAP black book to find that out. We might love our cars and want the best for it, but in the end, it's just a piece of metal and will only be worth what the book says. If I was out to by a Civic Type R and I had a choice between a Civic TR in a dealership and one for sale privately advertised having been serviced by a "Specialist" I know which I'd go for every time. The one which won't have nosedived in value. Last edited by LNT; 1st April 2008 at 23:00.

4th April 2008, 13:51	#30 (permalink)
LNT Triangular Exhaust Join Date: 24th March 2007 Location: England Posts: 220 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader: (0)	Anyone who pays MORE for a car, than the CAP book price for a CTR, would need their head testing. We're not talking Ferrari or Lambo here, we're talking mass market hot hatch. A CTR is not a "Performance car" as such, it's merely the sporty model of a range and is mass produced. A glance at Auto Trader will show over 150 New shape 2nd hand CTRs available, so it's not as though it's a rare car, so why pay more than you need to? If, in the event, you were daft enough to pay over the odds for a car without a full dealer history, what happens when you then want to sell on? Not only have you lost out in the first place, but you then take another massive hit. Plus, if someone has actually paid more for a "Specialist" car history, what does that say about the car in the first place? That it has probably been used to it's full potential and driven to its maximum. i.e thrashed (and if not, what's the point if it's not about the cost?) so potentially worth even less. I'm not sure where this idea that the dealers don't know about the CTR comes from, as they are all qualified and get sent on courses for the latest models all the time. If the "Specialist" does too, that's fine, but why are they therefore better? There are plenty of petrolheads in the dealers too, and take as much pride in their work as anyone. Don't judge the mechanics by the salesman! Perhaps Neemstar's APB Motorsport race tune CTRs for the track and so knows them inside out. In which case, it's possibly a fair shout, (although they appear to also "Specialise" in Saxo's, which is a bit of a worry) and it's possible that if that "Specialist" also sells a few CTR's he could perhaps demand more than the book price because of his race tuning reputation of the car and some people might be happy to pay it, obviously including Neemstar, but these "Specialists" are a rarity. In the end, though, if you then went to a dealer to sell it you'd still take a huge hit, and even if you took it back to the "Specialist" he'll never offer you over the book price. I used to have a Nova GTE which was serviced by a race mechanic who's daughter was a racing driver, drove great when it was serviced, but after a while, without the constant attention a racing car needs, it's not as good and drank fuel. So taking a car for servicing at a place like that might actually end up dearer anyway because of the more frequent trips to the garage. In the end, you pay your money and take your chance, but if a couple of years fast driving is worth losing a lot of money, then it's up to the individual. I know I've learnt my lesson the hard way. Last edited by LNT; 4th April 2008 at 13:53.

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This thread is about: Servicing...Warranty...don't need Honda or Honda Parts, it's in Buying, Dealers and Servicing at the Honda Civic forum Civinfo; Originally Posted by LNT The way I think about this is that 1. If cost doesn't matter, then always go to the franchised dealer, because ...

2nd April 2008, 04:14	#24 (permalink)
Kremmen Krem de la Krem Civinfo guru Join Date: 7th January 2007 Location: West London Posts: 2,628 Thanks: 8 Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts iTrader: (0)	The i-shift remap is only done if you ask. There are some items that they will do, but it has to be in the form of a complaint unfortunately. The HFT fix was another. Having said that though my original dealer claimed no knowledge of the i-shift upgrade which does sort of put my statement into the shade if some of them are not reading or digesting the service bulletins.

3rd April 2008, 00:40	#27 (permalink)
TTDegs Super Moderator Civinfo master Join Date: 4th August 2006 Location: Cardiff Posts: 5,638 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader: (0)	To my mind, there are 3 types of places you can take you car for work 1) Your fave Honda dealer. The downside is potentially the price (which I've covered elsewhere, and doesn't necessarily justify calling them stealers ). The upside is a guarantee of no future quibbles over if a part was of 'equal quality'. Plus the dealer stamp in the service book. 2) Your fave independant specialist. The downside is the lack of Honda stamp, and the pontential for quibble over quality of parts. May not get sent regular Honda updates. The upside is an indepth knowledge of the car, and potentially a cheaper bill (maybe). 3) The small garage at the end of the road. Upside - dead cheap. Downside - he only owns 2 spanners and a big hammer (yes, sweeping generalisation for comedic affect ) So. where you spend your cash is a personal choice As to resale value... Depends on who you are selling to! For example. Lets say that Neemstar and LNT (sorry gents, picked you as the 2 recent vocalists ) were both in the market for a 2nd hand CTR. Here we have, for sale, two identical CTRs. 1 has a book full of Honda stamps 1 has a book full of ABP stamps. LNT wouldn't touch the independant CTR with a barge poll Neemstar would however, prefer it to the Honda mantained one. And may, (I'm guessing here Neemstar, so apols if wrong!) actually have been willing to pay more for it, becuase it has been looked after by a specialist. Pays yer money, takes yer choice Whilst overall, I would personally go with Honda dealer on a non-CTR, if I had a CTR I would personally take the short term gain of specialist service over the long term potential loss.

3rd April 2008, 07:27	#28 (permalink)
Kremmen Krem de la Krem Civinfo guru Join Date: 7th January 2007 Location: West London Posts: 2,628 Thanks: 8 Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts iTrader: (0)	or.......... buy the cheaper one and take it straight to a Honda dealer for a full service and checkup.

4th April 2008, 15:29	#31 (permalink)
Minkster Locking Wheelnut Join Date: 31st May 2007 Location: Grantham, UK Posts: 124 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: (0)	I bought mine from Grantham Honda, part of the Lincolnshire Honda group - and they have something whereby they say that if you continue to get servicing from them, you receive an automatic extension to many warranty items - up to 100k miles I think

6th April 2008, 12:01	#33 (permalink)
deeny Wheelnut Join Date: 6th May 2007 Location: aberdare Posts: 66 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader: (0)	i also thought or was told the independent garage as to be vat registered as well as using genuine parts? to sustain your warranty

Yesterday, 09:29	#35 (permalink)
hgt Supporter Wheelnut Join Date: 11th October 2007 Location: Holmes Chapel, Cheshire Posts: 65 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: (0)	I had my first service recently, which consisted of oil and filter change. The oil I can buy at hafrauds for £38 and a genuine filter for £7.50 on the Internet. The dealer charged £150 for the service, that means they charged me £104.50 for 1 hours labour. As they get the oil and filter cheaper than I can they will have made more than £104.50. Then they get upset when we call them Stealer's. I will be taking my car to ABP in Crewe for its next service, their charges seem fair and reasonable. I know we all have to make a profit but over £104 an hour for labour, come off it Stealer's.

Yesterday, 09:54	#36 (permalink)
NoNumpty Supporter Triangular Exhaust Join Date: 20th May 2008 Location: Cheshire UK Posts: 348 Thanks: 13 Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts iTrader: (0)	They do a lot more than just change the oil Check here Maintenance Schedule - Civinfo Wiki Also £150 isn't bad - checkout other peoples service costs here Service Cost - Civinfo Wiki Had an oil change done on mine recently and the parts came to £88 - oil for diesel is different than for petrol - they didn't charge me for labour

Yesterday, 09:59	#38 (permalink)
Mr JP Magic Rear Seat Join Date: 2nd February 2007 Location: Kent, UK Posts: 659 Thanks: 4 Thanked 23 Times in 23 Posts iTrader: (0)	Yeah but your a good dealer

Yesterday, 10:29	#40 (permalink)
hgt Supporter Wheelnut Join Date: 11th October 2007 Location: Holmes Chapel, Cheshire Posts: 65 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: (0)	Everything else they listed on the service report was visual checks that I can do myself in less than 5 minutes. In fact this is another Dealer con on the public when they advertise a 80 point check etc, and all it consists of is visual checks that anybody with a couple of brain cells can do themselves. The point I am making is, I can do exactly what the dealer did, oil change, filter change and visual checks in less than 20 minutes I am not against the dealers making a profit but let it be a fair profit, not a rip off on an unsuspecting public.