Faults 2.2 Juddering / Stuttering @ 1500rpm Light Throttle

hussein · 24th November 2009, 18:08

I have an annoying problem with the smoothness of my 2006 2.2 iCTDI with 50k on the clock.

During 95% of all driving, the car is smooth. There is lots of power and it feels great. Acceleration is smooth through the whole rev range.

The problem shows up during town driving mainly and occurs at quite a specific rev range of 1500rpm which is a sensible driving engine speed. At a very gentle throttle (~10%) the car likes to act like a kangaroo and jump around as if it is close to stalling. This is roughly around 20mph in second and 26mph in third. This jumpiness goes away straight away if I give it a little more with my right foot.

It is possible to 'drive around the problem' by driving a little faster (not always possible), but it is still annoying when trying to make smooth relaxed progress in town traffic.

I thought maybe the car just really needs a service - its just had its big one (Level 4) at my local dealer on Friday so it has new oil and air/fuel/oil filters. Maybe it is because its just been driven around town for the past few months - so I went for a 300+ mile blast this weekend (I mean *blast*) to see a friend. Drove pretty hard and fast on the way there and took it easy on the way back. None of that seemed to make any difference.

Anyone got any ideas? Anyone ever experienced the same with their 2.2? It almost doesn't really feel like its a mechanical problem since it only happens at such a specific engine speed - is there a new version of a Honda 'map' that my dealer can put on which will stop this flat spot?

CatherineJ · 24th November 2009, 18:29

Back into the dealer would be my suggestion.

hussein · 24th November 2009, 18:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by CatherineJ

Back into the dealer would be my suggestion.

Yeah, I'll try that soon - but mainly I'd really like to see whether anyone else has had such a problem with their car so I can know a little more about it. I just know that if I took it straight to the dealer they will say "its fine!" and send me on my way.

By the way, I also tried Total Std and Premium, BP Std and Ultimate, Shell Std, and at the moment there is V-Power Diesel in there.

Chip · 24th November 2009, 19:17

Flywheel - dual mass flywheel failure?

Pottsy · 24th November 2009, 19:50

I would be suspicious of the EGR valve. It can cause stuttering or kangerooing, and it is not unusual for it to require attention.

http://www.civinfo.com/forum/how/256...-ctdi-fk3.html

hussein · 24th November 2009, 21:12

Thanks Pottsy!

Going to give that a look over asap. Also, very strangely on my drive home from work, the car seemed much smoother than usual around the 1500rpm mark. Very odd! A few days ago the problem was quite pronounced, but today it seems very slight. I hope it really is going away rather than being intermittent.

I'll know for sure in the morning though, it doesn't like cold mornings.

hussein · 24th November 2009, 22:12

Stuttering under light throttle 2.2

That thread is 2 years old, but it seems like exactly the problem I have.

dave7891 · 25th November 2009, 01:22

Hi,

I also have a very similar problem, but I am in the 1.8petrol.
So not sure if it is anything to do with the type of fuel that is being used.

I will be taking it to the dealer (with the ever growing list of other problems that I'm noticing) - including the gears/clutch that's making it difficult to select 1st from standing and down shifting into 2nd from 3rd - I thought this might have had something to do with the kangaroo effect but doesn't seem like it now.

If you visit the dealer could you let me no how it goes so they don't try fob me off with some old excuse.

Cheers.

Sue.S · 8th February 2013, 10:30

I have this exact same problem on my 2006 CTDI (58000 miles) Service and new fuel filter hasn't solved it. Has anyone resolved this issue?

It's at large intermittent but always as low revs either running down to a stop, setting off from a stop or changing gear (doesn't matter which gear either). Sometimes the kangaroo-ing is quite violent. Other than that and the strange random dropping of the revs when I've stopped down to 400-600rpm then back up to 800 rpm idle, the car is as smooth as anything. Tried diesel cleaners and V-power fuel which has made no difference at all.

Thanks

Jon_G · 8th February 2013, 11:20

I suggest that maybe either the EGR valve or the MAF sensor would benefit from a proper cleaning.

Welcome to the club!

Sue.S · 27th February 2013, 22:45

Thanks Jon-G< yeah its been in at the dealers and a full EGR clean and new MAF and still no different.

It's really doing my head in.

Relic · 28th February 2013, 01:10

The fact it drops to 3/4 or 1/2 800rpm might indicate its an injector shutting down.
The ECU has a correction algorythm where it tries to get equal torque from all 4 injectors by independantly varying the fuel load.
If one injector is clogged or sticking the ECU might be modulating the fuel to try and get a balanced idle.

Just an idea.
Honda can log the individual injectors and they have test functions for this they can run too.

Sue.S · 25th March 2013, 11:42

She's died!!!!

Started the car from cold this morning and noticed the revs pulsing slightly and I could hear it with the engine. Set off and the flat spots were awful all the way to work (15 miles). Got to 1 mile off work and a massive flat spot happened where I had my foot to the floor and the engine didn't repond to the input or the revs in any gear. Crawled along to the last set of lights and it stalled, couldn't get it going for a good 10 mins

. Eventually it stuttered into life and limped it into work. Phoned Honda this morning and it's going in and not coming back until they find something after I've been fobbed off on numerous occations as a no fault found!!!

This seems to me like something to do with the fuel delivery the way it just stalled and wouldn't fire back up. Still no engine management light though???? Weird!

Jon_G · 25th March 2013, 12:39

Sorry to hear that, but please do let us know what the problem was after Honda have sorted it out. Hope it isn't an expensive problem!

Sue.S · 25th March 2013, 13:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon_G

Sorry to hear that, but please do let us know what the problem was after Honda have sorted it out. Hope it isn't an expensive problem!

Thanks Jon G, me neither!!! I suspect it will be pricey though!!!

Just want it sorting out now but I will definitely post the verdict when I know.

firesharpe · 27th March 2013, 14:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sue.S

Thanks Jon G, me neither!!! I suspect it will be pricey though!!!

Just want it sorting out now but I will definitely post the verdict when I know.

Sue.S,

Did you ever get the problem sorted out as it sounds like exactly the same as the problem I am currently having. Would be nice to know if I am going to have my pants taken down by the dealer to get it sorted.

Thanks.

Rampz · 27th March 2013, 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sue.S

Thanks Jon G, me neither!!! I suspect it will be pricey though!!!

Just want it sorting out now but I will definitely post the verdict when I know.

Sounds bit like what my civic started doing this week, keeps stalling when idling almost like its misfiring...it's only started doing this about 2 weeks after my oil level sensor light came up on dash, so it's making me feel like its linked to that. Mechanics have told me could be a number of things from it could need globe plugs to car not getting enough air or too much air in engine.

interested to see what honda say the problem is

Sue.S · 12th April 2013, 07:56

Morning all...........

Drum roll please..................the cars fixed!!!!!

The culprit: EGR Valve!

The Honda dealer locally slaved a known good one on before going through the expense and pain of trying a new one and it cured it.

£600 bill mind but hey ho. Obviously the EGR clean didn't do a thing!

The last time it died on me, the fumes in the car were awful so whilst it was in I asked them to look at the manifold. Low and behold theres a crack in it and it's still in an extended 7 yr warranty from Honda under a service bulletin BY 19 DAYS!!!!

Phew! So its going back in for a new casted one for free!!!! Happy Days! It kind of took the sting out of the £600 EGR valve!

Jon_G · 12th April 2013, 08:20

Glad to hear it. But £600 = minor 'ouch'... but thanks for confirming the problem.

Very disappointing that the dealer didn't realise the EGR valve was faulty previously when they cleaned it, but excellent news that they caught the cracked manifold in time!

Sue.S · 12th April 2013, 08:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon_G

Glad to hear it. But £600 = minor 'ouch'... but thanks for confirming the problem.

Very disappointing that the dealer didn't realise the EGR valve was faulty previously when they cleaned it, but excellent news that they caught the cracked manifold in time!

Tell me about it Jon! You peeps have been more helpful to solve this issue than their "technicians!" as they seem to call themselves, but it appears they haven't a clue unless theres a fault code glaring at them.

It actually cost me a hell of a lot of money trying to sort this issue out purely because they couldn't reproduce the fault and didn't believe there was a problem! It was only for the fact that I refused to take the car back until they drove it again and it died on THEM, did they start to believe it. Dissappointing to say the least.

But at least I get a manifold out of it

24th November 2009, 18:08	#1 (permalink)
hussein Dude Car: 2006 EK3 EX, Cosmic. Join Date: 19th March 2009 Location: Sector ZZ9PZA Posts: 112 Thanks given: 10 Thanked 8 Times in 7 Posts iTrader: (4)	2.2 Juddering / Stuttering @ 1500rpm Light Throttle I have an annoying problem with the smoothness of my 2006 2.2 iCTDI with 50k on the clock. During 95% of all driving, the car is smooth. There is lots of power and it feels great. Acceleration is smooth through the whole rev range. The problem shows up during town driving mainly and occurs at quite a specific rev range of 1500rpm which is a sensible driving engine speed. At a very gentle throttle (~10%) the car likes to act like a kangaroo and jump around as if it is close to stalling. This is roughly around 20mph in second and 26mph in third. This jumpiness goes away straight away if I give it a little more with my right foot. It is possible to 'drive around the problem' by driving a little faster (not always possible), but it is still annoying when trying to make smooth relaxed progress in town traffic. I thought maybe the car just really needs a service - its just had its big one (Level 4) at my local dealer on Friday so it has new oil and air/fuel/oil filters. Maybe it is because its just been driven around town for the past few months - so I went for a 300+ mile blast this weekend (I mean blast) to see a friend. Drove pretty hard and fast on the way there and took it easy on the way back. None of that seemed to make any difference. Anyone got any ideas? Anyone ever experienced the same with their 2.2? It almost doesn't really feel like its a mechanical problem since it only happens at such a specific engine speed - is there a new version of a Honda 'map' that my dealer can put on which will stop this flat spot?

LinkBacks (?) LinkBack to this Thread: http://www.civinfo.com/forum/engines-transmission/34121-2-2-juddering-stuttering-1500rpm-light-throttle.html
Posted By	For	Type	Date
Honda Car Transmission Stutter \| Stutter	This thread	Refback	15th January 2010 17:40

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24th November 2009, 18:29	#2 (permalink)
CatherineJ Join Date: 23rd August 2008 Location: Wiltshire, UK Posts: 883 Thanks given: 3 Thanked 34 Times in 33 Posts iTrader: (0)	Back into the dealer would be my suggestion.

24th November 2009, 19:17	#4 (permalink)
Chip Join Date: 5th March 2009 Location: Herts Posts: 2,213 Thanks given: 226 Thanked 154 Times in 147 Posts iTrader: (0)	Flywheel - dual mass flywheel failure?

24th November 2009, 19:50	#5 (permalink)
Pottsy Administrator Car: Jag XF 3.0 Join Date: 10th April 2006 Location: Leics Posts: 12,337 Thanks given: 127 Thanked 2,267 Times in 775 Posts iTrader: (0)	I would be suspicious of the EGR valve. It can cause stuttering or kangerooing, and it is not unusual for it to require attention. http://www.civinfo.com/forum/how/256...-ctdi-fk3.html

24th November 2009, 21:12	#6 (permalink)
hussein Dude Thread starter Car: 2006 EK3 EX, Cosmic. Join Date: 19th March 2009 Location: Sector ZZ9PZA Posts: 112 Thanks given: 10 Thanked 8 Times in 7 Posts iTrader: (4)	Thanks Pottsy! Going to give that a look over asap. Also, very strangely on my drive home from work, the car seemed much smoother than usual around the 1500rpm mark. Very odd! A few days ago the problem was quite pronounced, but today it seems very slight. I hope it really is going away rather than being intermittent. I'll know for sure in the morning though, it doesn't like cold mornings.

24th November 2009, 22:12	#7 (permalink)
hussein Dude Thread starter Car: 2006 EK3 EX, Cosmic. Join Date: 19th March 2009 Location: Sector ZZ9PZA Posts: 112 Thanks given: 10 Thanked 8 Times in 7 Posts iTrader: (4)	Stuttering under light throttle 2.2 That thread is 2 years old, but it seems like exactly the problem I have.

25th November 2009, 01:22	#8 (permalink)
dave7891 .............. Car: 2006 ES 5 Door Silver Join Date: 24th June 2009 Location: Scotland, Glasgow Posts: 36 Thanks given: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: (0)	Hi, I also have a very similar problem, but I am in the 1.8petrol. So not sure if it is anything to do with the type of fuel that is being used. I will be taking it to the dealer (with the ever growing list of other problems that I'm noticing) - including the gears/clutch that's making it difficult to select 1st from standing and down shifting into 2nd from 3rd - I thought this might have had something to do with the kangaroo effect but doesn't seem like it now. If you visit the dealer could you let me no how it goes so they don't try fob me off with some old excuse. Cheers.

8th February 2013, 10:30	#9 (permalink)
Sue.S Car: Civic 2006 2.2 ctdi EX Join Date: 16th July 2012 Location: UK Posts: 6 Thanks given: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader: (0)	I have this exact same problem on my 2006 CTDI (58000 miles) Service and new fuel filter hasn't solved it. Has anyone resolved this issue? It's at large intermittent but always as low revs either running down to a stop, setting off from a stop or changing gear (doesn't matter which gear either). Sometimes the kangaroo-ing is quite violent. Other than that and the strange random dropping of the revs when I've stopped down to 400-600rpm then back up to 800 rpm idle, the car is as smooth as anything. Tried diesel cleaners and V-power fuel which has made no difference at all. Thanks

8th February 2013, 11:20	#10 (permalink)
Jon_G Goat Fancier Car: 2005 Accord iCTDi Tourer Join Date: 11th May 2012 Location: Ludlow, UK Posts: 892 Thanks given: 59 Thanked 143 Times in 123 Posts iTrader: (0)	I suggest that maybe either the EGR valve or the MAF sensor would benefit from a proper cleaning. Welcome to the club!

27th February 2013, 22:45	#11 (permalink)
Sue.S Car: Civic 2006 2.2 ctdi EX Join Date: 16th July 2012 Location: UK Posts: 6 Thanks given: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader: (0)	Thanks Jon-G< yeah its been in at the dealers and a full EGR clean and new MAF and still no different. It's really doing my head in.

28th February 2013, 01:10	#12 (permalink)
Relic Cockup Specialist Car: 2007 2.2 Type 'S' GT, Bronze Join Date: 31st August 2009 Location: uk Posts: 12,151 Thanks given: 737 Thanked 1,453 Times in 1,275 Posts iTrader: (0)	The fact it drops to 3/4 or 1/2 800rpm might indicate its an injector shutting down. The ECU has a correction algorythm where it tries to get equal torque from all 4 injectors by independantly varying the fuel load. If one injector is clogged or sticking the ECU might be modulating the fuel to try and get a balanced idle. Just an idea. Honda can log the individual injectors and they have test functions for this they can run too.

25th March 2013, 11:42	#13 (permalink)
Sue.S Car: Civic 2006 2.2 ctdi EX Join Date: 16th July 2012 Location: UK Posts: 6 Thanks given: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader: (0)	She's died!!!! Started the car from cold this morning and noticed the revs pulsing slightly and I could hear it with the engine. Set off and the flat spots were awful all the way to work (15 miles). Got to 1 mile off work and a massive flat spot happened where I had my foot to the floor and the engine didn't repond to the input or the revs in any gear. Crawled along to the last set of lights and it stalled, couldn't get it going for a good 10 mins . Eventually it stuttered into life and limped it into work. Phoned Honda this morning and it's going in and not coming back until they find something after I've been fobbed off on numerous occations as a no fault found!!! This seems to me like something to do with the fuel delivery the way it just stalled and wouldn't fire back up. Still no engine management light though???? Weird!

25th March 2013, 12:39	#14 (permalink)
Jon_G Goat Fancier Car: 2005 Accord iCTDi Tourer Join Date: 11th May 2012 Location: Ludlow, UK Posts: 892 Thanks given: 59 Thanked 143 Times in 123 Posts iTrader: (0)	Sorry to hear that, but please do let us know what the problem was after Honda have sorted it out. Hope it isn't an expensive problem!

12th April 2013, 07:56	#18 (permalink)
Sue.S Car: Civic 2006 2.2 ctdi EX Join Date: 16th July 2012 Location: UK Posts: 6 Thanks given: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader: (0)	Morning all........... Drum roll please..................the cars fixed!!!!! The culprit: EGR Valve! The Honda dealer locally slaved a known good one on before going through the expense and pain of trying a new one and it cured it. £600 bill mind but hey ho. Obviously the EGR clean didn't do a thing! The last time it died on me, the fumes in the car were awful so whilst it was in I asked them to look at the manifold. Low and behold theres a crack in it and it's still in an extended 7 yr warranty from Honda under a service bulletin BY 19 DAYS!!!! Phew! So its going back in for a new casted one for free!!!! Happy Days! It kind of took the sting out of the £600 EGR valve!

12th April 2013, 08:20	#19 (permalink)
Jon_G Goat Fancier Car: 2005 Accord iCTDi Tourer Join Date: 11th May 2012 Location: Ludlow, UK Posts: 892 Thanks given: 59 Thanked 143 Times in 123 Posts iTrader: (0)	Glad to hear it. But £600 = minor 'ouch'... but thanks for confirming the problem. Very disappointing that the dealer didn't realise the EGR valve was faulty previously when they cleaned it, but excellent news that they caught the cracked manifold in time!