Other Civic 2.2 revs dropping below idle speed when stopping at junction - Civinfo

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post #1 of 56 (permalink) Old 19th March 2017, 22:54 Thread Starter
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Civic 2.2 revs dropping below idle speed when stopping at junction

Hi chaps,

I'm hoping one of you guys will have the solution to the grief I've been having with my 2.2 recently.

I start the engine from cold, it starts instantly and settles to a perfect idle. I drive the car 50m to a junction, come to a stop and the revs dip to 500rpm as though the engine is going to stall then the revs pick up to 850rpm idle speed.
It does this whether the gearbox is in neutral or clutch dipped so its not clutch drag.

It still does this when warm but the revs only drop to about 700rpm so much less noticeable.

So far I've cleaned, MAF and MAP sensors, replaced the fuel filter, cleaned and tested the EGR. Also unplugged MAF and MAP sensors, plugged EGR and the car still behaves the same.

Farqui brought me an injector leakback test kit, the injectors seem fine to me. No problems with a particular one- see pic.

The car drives PERFECT off idle.

Also checked APP (throttle pedal) using the HDS and the fuel pressure at idle is 300bar- on target.

Can see nothing abnormal externally on the engine. No vac pipes or boost pipes loose.

No check engine light.

Any ideas?

Oh and thanks to Jon who's been helping me via PM
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post #2 of 56 (permalink) Old 19th March 2017, 23:05
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It's also had a new battery...
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post #3 of 56 (permalink) Old 19th March 2017, 23:09 Thread Starter
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Oh yes, and a new battery as the other one wouldn't hold charge (original one though so can't complain).
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post #4 of 56 (permalink) Old 19th March 2017, 23:25
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Mine occasionally does the same, just had a full service but hasn't fix it. I told Adamsnake about it and he kindly run his HDS on the car and all appears well. Mine has only done it since the Celtic stage 2+ was put on. Can't be EGR as mine is blanked off, I've also switched from Tesco diesel to Esso Supreme diesel and no difference. I had the clutch damper bypass hose fitted and that didn't make any difference either.

Last edited by fatwelshboy; 19th March 2017 at 23:29. Reason: Added bypass info.
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post #5 of 56 (permalink) Old 19th March 2017, 23:35 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fatwelshboy View Post
Mine occasionally does the same, just had a full service but hasn't fix it. I told Adamsnake about it and he kindly run his HDS on the car and all appears well. Mine has only done it since the Celtic stage 2+ was put on. Can't be EGR as mine is blanked off, I've also switched from Tesco diesel to Esso Supreme diesel and no difference.
Hmm mine is remapped but didn't always do it since remap. I'm hoping to do some datalogging once I get a working laptop. The laptop crashes when I try live data with the HDS. I thought it was the HDS clone but my neighbour kindly loaded the HDS software onto his laptop, tested it with the HDS in my car and it works flawlessly. He's currently wiping my laptop and starting again with it he thinks the software is conflicting somewhere on it and causes it to crash.
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post #6 of 56 (permalink) Old 19th March 2017, 23:44
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I was hoping a full service would fix it as the low revs cause the exhaust to knock and the Mrs gets really wound up by the knocking. I've only got Dash Command for iPhone but it does some data logging. Not sure what to log tbh, I suppose fuel flow would be a start?
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post #7 of 56 (permalink) Old 19th March 2017, 23:51 Thread Starter
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Fuel pressure is bang on target though and injector leak back test showed up fine. Hopefully the HDS will show up an anomaly in real time logging when I get the laptop fixed. This also happens in stop start traffic.

I can't replicate it when the car is sat stationary on the drive. It only does it when the car comes to a stop after it's been driven.
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post #8 of 56 (permalink) Old 19th March 2017, 23:59 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fatwelshboy View Post
I was hoping a full service would fix it as the low revs cause the exhaust to knock and the Mrs gets really wound up by the knocking. I've only got Dash Command for iPhone but it does some data logging. Not sure what to log tbh, I suppose fuel flow would be a start?
One other thing to add about fuel pressure logging, theoretically the pressure may drop below target if the revs drop below target, as the pump will be moving slower. Something is making the revs kick back up though.

This is a strange problem and very frustrating. There's only been a few posts of this happening before and nobody posted up a cure. I certainly don't want to start playing parts darts with it.
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post #9 of 56 (permalink) Old 20th March 2017, 00:03
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Did you get a chance to check the glow plugs yet?

Mine were within spec and yet the car ran smoother with new ones.

They aren't expensive and should be replaced every 60k miles.

I understand that you don't the want to shell out for parts that don't help and I'm not convinced they'll cure your issue. But keep them in mind.
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post #10 of 56 (permalink) Old 20th March 2017, 00:05 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Farqui View Post
Did you get a chance to check the glow plugs yet?

Mine were within spec and yet the car ran smoother with new ones.

They aren't expensive and should be replaced every 60k miles.

I understand that you do the want to shell out for parts that don't help and I'm not convinced they'll cure your issue. But keep them in mind.

No no chance yet but I'll test them. I may just replace them anyway as its on 150k now.
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post #11 of 56 (permalink) Old 20th March 2017, 00:08
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I'll try and record mine doing it. It's an intermittent issue and there's no pattern to it, hot or cold engine doesn't make a difference. Doesn't really bother me as it doesn't stall but it would be nice to find the cause.
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post #12 of 56 (permalink) Old 20th March 2017, 00:13 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by fatwelshboy View Post
I'll try and record mine doing it. It's an intermittent issue and there's no pattern to it, hot or cold engine doesn't make a difference. Doesn't really bother me as it doesn't stall but it would be nice to find the cause.
Yes I must admit that its not a major problem as the 500rpm only happens when the engine is cold. As soon as its warm its nothing to worry about. Certainly not enough to be taking it to Honda especially as I can do all the checks they will do with the HDS, once my laptop is fixed.
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post #13 of 56 (permalink) Old 20th March 2017, 00:19
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I've just had a thought, I changed the speed sensor on my car as the old one packed in. My speedo does over read a fair bit compared to a sat nav and the speedo in the onboard diagnostics. My speedo before read 74 to the sat navs 70, it now reads about 77 to the sat navs 70. Thinking about it the speed sensor was changed before the remap so I doubt some sort of speed sensor issue is the cause.
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post #14 of 56 (permalink) Old 20th March 2017, 10:20
 
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Mine does this too, isn't remapped and only seems to occur when I pop it in neutral and coast to a stop under braking (although you shouldn't do this, I occasionally do).

Drops to about 500 RPM then picks up again. I have read this somewhere else on the forum, I'm not too worried about it as it hasn't stalled on me and seems to pick itself up again.
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post #15 of 56 (permalink) Old 23rd March 2017, 18:43 Thread Starter
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Right some more info on this. I'm not convinced it's an actual engine problem. I had the HDS connected today for 25mins and it never crashed I think the HDS HIM is faulty.

What I noticed is the clutch switch when the pedal is fully to the floor doesn't light up green on the data list. The switch when you first start to press the pedal works every time. Could this be having an affect on idle? E.g. the ecu not seeing pedal down and not lifting idle speed? Which switch is meant to be A and which should be B?

Another thing I noticed today. If I'm rolling very slowly to a stop, the idle revs instantly pick up to where they should be at 2mph. Seems to happen every time when the revs drop.
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post #16 of 56 (permalink) Old 23rd March 2017, 19:28
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Surge View Post
Mine does this too, isn't remapped and only seems to occur when I pop it in neutral and coast to a stop under braking (although you shouldn't do this, I occasionally do).

Drops to about 500 RPM then picks up again. I have read this somewhere else on the forum, I'm not too worried about it as it hasn't stalled on me and seems to pick itself up again.
Same here. Mine is 1.8 petrol. Full service, injector cleaner and spark plug change hasn't cured it. I just live with it now.

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post #17 of 56 (permalink) Old 23rd March 2017, 20:08 Thread Starter
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Same here. Mine is 1.8 petrol. Full service, injector cleaner and spark plug change hasn't cured it. I just live with it now.

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I can't see how that's related to a 2.2 doing it as one is diesel and the other petrol. Unless it is the clutch switch at fault.........
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post #18 of 56 (permalink) Old 23rd March 2017, 20:09
 
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Originally Posted by hondacivicnut View Post
I can't see how that's related to a 2.2 doing it as one is diesel and the other petrol. Unless it is the clutch switch at fault.........
Yeah just adding that it may not be engine related as we both have different engines.

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post #19 of 56 (permalink) Old 23rd March 2017, 20:11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hondacivicnut View Post
Right some more info on this. I'm not convinced it's an actual engine problem. I had the HDS connected today for 25mins and it never crashed I think the HDS HIM is faulty.

What I noticed is the clutch switch when the pedal is fully to the floor doesn't light up green on the data list. The switch when you first start to press the pedal works every time. Could this be having an affect on idle? E.g. the ecu not seeing pedal down and not lifting idle speed? Which switch is meant to be A and which should be B?

Another thing I noticed today. If I'm rolling very slowly to a stop, the idle revs instantly pick up to where they should be at 2mph. Seems to happen every time when the revs drop.
Interesting...

I wish I could be more helpful Mick!
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post #20 of 56 (permalink) Old 23rd March 2017, 20:16 Thread Starter
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Done a bit more digging. Switch A is the 2pin connector and should have continuity when the clutch pedal is at full stroke in the down position. Switch B is the 3pin connector and teminals 2 and 3 should have continuity when the clutch pedal is in the up position, released.

Switch A isn't working as it should on mine so I'll fix that.
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