Acceleration, top speed and cornering anyone?

babyjoe · 12th December 2006, 22:38

Hello,

As I am in doubt of buying either a Civic 2.2d or a Bmw 320d, I would want to know what you owners think of these issues (0-100, top and cornering).
I am rather a *sporty* driver, and this affects the outcome a lot.
For the moment, I'm leaning towards the Civic, from what I've read it's quite a powerhouse, practical and down to earth (minus all the irritating mistakes). The BMW is OK, a bit slower, and all the extras do cost quite a lot, but it is a big and comfy car.

As I have read a couple of times, it seems that the car has more than the 140hp listed?? Is this correct, and is this everywhere in Europe?
Is the 0-100 in 8.6s correct (most manufacturers are off by a whole second here, they most likely measure this by ruining their clutch)

What are your top speeds (Autobahn of course?)
I've read somewhere here of somebody doing 229?

I know the BMW is a lot more fun at cornering, it's backwheel driven and handles so smooth, how is this with the civic?

Korkut Varol · 12th December 2006, 22:57

Without going into brands; for a slippery road condition, I would prefer a FWD, if not for an AWD. It is much more stable than a RWD.
In dry weather, a RWD can be more fun to corner.
But I think that the Civic's cockpit is very much futuristic and will be a big plus to your joy while driving.
I would advise that you take a personal test drive for both, and see the thrust of the 2.2 in mid-range engine speeds. (I own a 1.8 petrol but that property about the 2.2D is a consensus in this forum)
See if the BMW can give you an equal joy of driving... I don't think it will give you more...

Pottsy · 12th December 2006, 23:00

Babyjoe,

The diesel really comes into it's own when chipped - so I'd plan on chipping the car. The handling is good, in fact very good given the fact that it is FWD, with a forward weight bias, and simple rear suspension. It is obviously well tuned, and fitted with quick steering.

I'd drive both, and make sure the Civic fits your needs. I too like quick cars (had many Porsches) and the Civic is just fine.

Some theoretical performance figures are here:

Theoretical performance figures

czechplastik · 12th December 2006, 23:18

Hey babyjoe, the offical BHP for the 2.2 is 138 althought tests by members here have found it to be closer to 148.

Ditmar · 13th December 2006, 08:18

I'd say let the car speak for itself, make a testdrive in the 1.8 gasonline and the 2.2 diesel, then you will know if it suits your sporty driver needs.

I'd say the Civic should meet your demands.

Honda100 · 13th December 2006, 08:30

Very happy with my 2.2 diesel. The low down torque is stunning and you can out accelerate most 'normal' cars on the road. It cruises all day at 80 mph/130 kph, with 90 mph/144 kph equaling an indicated 2500 rpm, which is hardly stressing the engine at all. Its a great looking car and the faults are niggles rather than major issues.

Fedorov · 13th December 2006, 12:10

Had this 1.8 Petrol Civic for 3 days now, I REALLY miss the power of my 2.2 EX Diesel!!!

I don't thrash my car around, I keep a very respectable 45-47 mpg on every tank full of fuel but on this 1.8 it had 40 mpg average when I got it on Monday and it's already down to 38 with me I guess trying to get it to pull away and move as quick as my diesel does

jme1978 · 13th December 2006, 12:40

Quick answers:

Cornering - Civic isn't as good as others I've driven possibly down to the rear suspension which is not independant. It is low and wide tho so there is less body roll but it's not as good as the old focus.

Speed / Acc - The engine is great, very usuable torque. More fun than high powered petrol non turbo cars I've had.

Civic v BMW - well if your not concerned about the cost then its a no brain BMW call. Just taking into account their after sales service for one. If its value for money then its closer. You get more for your money with the civic but the quality of the BMW is always worth considering. If its kit your after then the Civic will whallop the BMW everywhere pound for pound.

Hope that helps!!

J

babyjoe · 13th December 2006, 13:03

Thank you all very much for your kind help.
I'm getting testdrives done somewhere in january, bit busy lately.
I'm on a fixed budget, meaning, I can get a nice equiped civic, or a standard bmw, with some extras. (I really hate you have to pay more for your a folding back seat, and all other small things.)
If I'm right they compare excellently in how much space you get and reliability of the cars. I'm going to make a pro/contra list!

steveking1000 · 13th December 2006, 15:15

As luck would have it, I had a loan 320d for 6 weeks before I got my Civic so I went right from one to the other.

IMHO, the Civic is the better car and much more fun without considering the costs. Once you factor the costs in, you would be mad to go for the BMW.

Having had a few BMW's and a Mini, the aftersales service is good but so far on my 30k mile Civic, I've not needed any so would you rather have a car with good service or a car that doesn't rely on good dealer service?

Hondamatic · 13th December 2006, 19:31

On a flat strech of Autobahn with regular (not the Ultimate / V-power type) diesel and a moderate wind from the side I easily reached 215 km/h on the clock in the Civic. I feel I could have pushed it a little further, but I'd say that 220 km/h is pretty much it when not having a strong backwind and going downhill. Then 229 would be feasible, I suppose.
Also having driven the BMW 1 series, I found that it is not handling that much better. Furthermore, I am always cautious with a rear wheel drive car, as you can't just lift the throttle when it's going to slide. My previous car was a Sub WRX Prodrive (265 bhp), and I felt much safer in that at any speed compared to the BMW, as it will slide on all four wheels, rather than the back trying to overtake the rear. The Civic is a lot of fun to drive, I guess you'd have to be a real racing driver to prefer the BMW.
The diesel in the Civic is superior in comfort to the 163 bhp unit of the 120d imho. If BMW decide to build a 130d..., then the story will be different.
If you need space in your car, then the Civic will beat the BMW anyday because of the FWD and the gastank being in the middle.
Buy the BMW if you care about what the neighbours think your car drives like, buy a Honda if you care about what you know your car drives like.

misterpro · 13th December 2006, 23:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by czechplastik

Hey babyjoe, the offical BHP for the 2.2 is 138 althought tests by members here have found it to be closer to 148.

Starting to wonder if they just come up with a random'ish number to badge the BHP...

Belgian Civic are marked 140 BHP, website, sales papers, insurance papers, all 140 BHP

ninooke · 14th December 2006, 10:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by misterpro

Starting to wonder if they just come up with a random'ish number to badge the BHP...

Belgian Civic are marked 140 BHP, website, sales papers, insurance papers, all 140 BHP

VAG also "underestimates" the bhp rating of its 2.0TDI engine (about 146bhp but rated at 140). I think 140BHP is the power output at the flywheel under worse circumstances than we know it (poor quality diesel, hotter intake air,...). Also, there might be a 2 - 3 bhp difference between two different cars leaving Swindon, they got to make up for that as well.
On the same dyno, I've seen differences of as much as 8 bhp on stock B18C5 (the Integra) engines. So IMHO 140bhp is a worst case scenario, +- 150 a best case scenario.

Correct me if I'm talking rubbish here and apologies for not being a native speaker.

IWANTACIVIC · 23rd December 2006, 06:12

yer i spoken to pepole thats got 1-3 sersis bmw and all but 1 would swop me and if you read reiabliy studys bmw and merc are no were near as good as they used to be middle table. were honda are top 5 they may have a few minor niggles that i bet you will get with 1 series or other new models but it major problems that matter. allround i would so test the 3 cars but after the cdti civic pound 4 pound its good to be the winner.

12th December 2006, 22:38	#1 (permalink)
babyjoe Wheelnut Join Date: 1st November 2006 Location: Belgium Posts: 67 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Acceleration, top speed and cornering anyone? Hello, As I am in doubt of buying either a Civic 2.2d or a Bmw 320d, I would want to know what you owners think of these issues (0-100, top and cornering). I am rather a sporty driver, and this affects the outcome a lot. For the moment, I'm leaning towards the Civic, from what I've read it's quite a powerhouse, practical and down to earth (minus all the irritating mistakes). The BMW is OK, a bit slower, and all the extras do cost quite a lot, but it is a big and comfy car. As I have read a couple of times, it seems that the car has more than the 140hp listed?? Is this correct, and is this everywhere in Europe? Is the 0-100 in 8.6s correct (most manufacturers are off by a whole second here, they most likely measure this by ruining their clutch) What are your top speeds (Autobahn of course?) I've read somewhere here of somebody doing 229? I know the BMW is a lot more fun at cornering, it's backwheel driven and handles so smooth, how is this with the civic? Last edited by babyjoe; 13th December 2006 at 12:58.

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This thread is about: Acceleration, top speed and cornering anyone?, it's in General Discussion at the Honda Civic forum Civinfo; Hello, As I am in doubt of buying either a Civic 2.2d or a Bmw 320d, I would want to know what you owners think ...

12th December 2006, 22:57	#2 (permalink)
Korkut Varol Triangular Exhaust Join Date: 31st October 2006 Location: Ankara, Turkey Posts: 461 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Without going into brands; for a slippery road condition, I would prefer a FWD, if not for an AWD. It is much more stable than a RWD. In dry weather, a RWD can be more fun to corner. But I think that the Civic's cockpit is very much futuristic and will be a big plus to your joy while driving. I would advise that you take a personal test drive for both, and see the thrust of the 2.2 in mid-range engine speeds. (I own a 1.8 petrol but that property about the 2.2D is a consensus in this forum) See if the BMW can give you an equal joy of driving... I don't think it will give you more...

12th December 2006, 23:00	#3 (permalink)
Pottsy Administrator Civinfo guru Join Date: 10th April 2006 Location: Leics Posts: 4,985 Thanks: 8 Thanked 91 Times in 49 Posts	Babyjoe, The diesel really comes into it's own when chipped - so I'd plan on chipping the car. The handling is good, in fact very good given the fact that it is FWD, with a forward weight bias, and simple rear suspension. It is obviously well tuned, and fitted with quick steering. I'd drive both, and make sure the Civic fits your needs. I too like quick cars (had many Porsches) and the Civic is just fine. Some theoretical performance figures are here: Theoretical performance figures

12th December 2006, 23:18	#4 (permalink)
czechplastik King of the rodeo Civinfo guru Join Date: 24th October 2006 Location: Belfast Posts: 4,500 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hey babyjoe, the offical BHP for the 2.2 is 138 althought tests by members here have found it to be closer to 148.

13th December 2006, 08:18	#5 (permalink)
Ditmar Valve Cap Join Date: 4th December 2006 Location: Zoetermeer Posts: 21 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I'd say let the car speak for itself, make a testdrive in the 1.8 gasonline and the 2.2 diesel, then you will know if it suits your sporty driver needs. I'd say the Civic should meet your demands.

13th December 2006, 08:30	#6 (permalink)
Honda100 Supporter Triangular Exhaust Join Date: 31st May 2006 Location: Stockport Posts: 238 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Very happy with my 2.2 diesel. The low down torque is stunning and you can out accelerate most 'normal' cars on the road. It cruises all day at 80 mph/130 kph, with 90 mph/144 kph equaling an indicated 2500 rpm, which is hardly stressing the engine at all. Its a great looking car and the faults are niggles rather than major issues.

13th December 2006, 12:10	#7 (permalink)
Fedorov Supporter Magic Rear Seat Join Date: 15th April 2006 Posts: 783 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Had this 1.8 Petrol Civic for 3 days now, I REALLY miss the power of my 2.2 EX Diesel!!! I don't thrash my car around, I keep a very respectable 45-47 mpg on every tank full of fuel but on this 1.8 it had 40 mpg average when I got it on Monday and it's already down to 38 with me I guess trying to get it to pull away and move as quick as my diesel does

13th December 2006, 12:40	#8 (permalink)
jme1978 Triangular Exhaust Join Date: 29th April 2006 Location: Cheshire Posts: 211 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Quick answers: Cornering - Civic isn't as good as others I've driven possibly down to the rear suspension which is not independant. It is low and wide tho so there is less body roll but it's not as good as the old focus. Speed / Acc - The engine is great, very usuable torque. More fun than high powered petrol non turbo cars I've had. Civic v BMW - well if your not concerned about the cost then its a no brain BMW call. Just taking into account their after sales service for one. If its value for money then its closer. You get more for your money with the civic but the quality of the BMW is always worth considering. If its kit your after then the Civic will whallop the BMW everywhere pound for pound. Hope that helps!! J

13th December 2006, 13:03	#9 (permalink)
babyjoe Wheelnut Join Date: 1st November 2006 Location: Belgium Posts: 67 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thank you all very much for your kind help. I'm getting testdrives done somewhere in january, bit busy lately. I'm on a fixed budget, meaning, I can get a nice equiped civic, or a standard bmw, with some extras. (I really hate you have to pay more for your a folding back seat, and all other small things.) If I'm right they compare excellently in how much space you get and reliability of the cars. I'm going to make a pro/contra list!

13th December 2006, 15:15	#10 (permalink)
steveking1000 Wheelnut Join Date: 9th June 2006 Location: Somerset, UK Posts: 73 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	As luck would have it, I had a loan 320d for 6 weeks before I got my Civic so I went right from one to the other. IMHO, the Civic is the better car and much more fun without considering the costs. Once you factor the costs in, you would be mad to go for the BMW. Having had a few BMW's and a Mini, the aftersales service is good but so far on my 30k mile Civic, I've not needed any so would you rather have a car with good service or a car that doesn't rely on good dealer service?

13th December 2006, 19:31	#11 (permalink)
Hondamatic Valve Cap Join Date: 10th December 2006 Location: , Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	On a flat strech of Autobahn with regular (not the Ultimate / V-power type) diesel and a moderate wind from the side I easily reached 215 km/h on the clock in the Civic. I feel I could have pushed it a little further, but I'd say that 220 km/h is pretty much it when not having a strong backwind and going downhill. Then 229 would be feasible, I suppose. Also having driven the BMW 1 series, I found that it is not handling that much better. Furthermore, I am always cautious with a rear wheel drive car, as you can't just lift the throttle when it's going to slide. My previous car was a Sub WRX Prodrive (265 bhp), and I felt much safer in that at any speed compared to the BMW, as it will slide on all four wheels, rather than the back trying to overtake the rear. The Civic is a lot of fun to drive, I guess you'd have to be a real racing driver to prefer the BMW. The diesel in the Civic is superior in comfort to the 163 bhp unit of the 120d imho. If BMW decide to build a 130d..., then the story will be different. If you need space in your car, then the Civic will beat the BMW anyday because of the FWD and the gastank being in the middle. Buy the BMW if you care about what the neighbours think your car drives like, buy a Honda if you care about what you know your car drives like.

23rd December 2006, 06:12	#14 (permalink)
IWANTACIVIC Supporter Magic Rear Seat Join Date: 16th September 2006 Location: LINCS UK Posts: 658 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	yer i spoken to pepole thats got 1-3 sersis bmw and all but 1 would swop me and if you read reiabliy studys bmw and merc are no were near as good as they used to be middle table. were honda are top 5 they may have a few minor niggles that i bet you will get with 1 series or other new models but it major problems that matter. allround i would so test the 3 cars but after the cdti civic pound 4 pound its good to be the winner.