Glad its gone

[Topcat]

Originally Posted by Brodick

Oh that's nice see FWH TC has two friends now aswell

LOL !!

[Hartside]

That's your choice. I do not tend to go to my dealer for every little squeek or rattle or scratch

No and neither do I! A defective Satnav screen flickering away is hardly a "little squeek, rattle or scratch" and neither is the bloody great clunks coming off the suspension it's been back and forward for, nor the battery that keeps going flat!

jeez.......some people!

[Jack The Lad.]

I, like so many on here have had to work bloody hard for my dosh and if I now had the money that I have spent on new cars over the years - "This time next year, I would be a millionare Rodney".
Yes, I get p-ssed off with things going wrong with them, but at the end of the day, its a bit of metal and plastic made by humans, who make mistakes as we all do. In the overall scheme of things, on this little dying planet of ours, is it worth a toss ?.
Health, some happiness, a few bob in ones pocket and a decent "Er Indoors", is all that matters.
Thats my H.O. for what its worth anyway. ?

[Pumatron]

Originally Posted by Jack The Lad.

I, like so many on here have had to work bloody hard for my dosh and if I now had the money that I have spent on new cars over the years - "This time next year, I would be a millionare Rodney".
Yes, I get p-ssed off with things going wrong with them, but at the end of the day, its a bit of metal and plastic made by humans, who make mistakes as we all do. In the overall scheme of things, on this little dying planet of ours, is it worth a toss ?.
Health, some happiness, a few bob in ones pocket and a decent "Er Indoors", is all that matters.
Thats my H.O. for what its worth anyway. ?

Well said that man.........Come on guys listen to yourselves, this is the way of the world now, a throw away society, if you want perfection you have got to dig deep, very deep. I think almost everything I have bought in the last few years has got problems of some sort which includes TV's, games consoles, anything from mothercare, toys, lawn mowers, furniture, some food, cars, mountain bike etc. I can't think of anything that I have bought which has not had a flaw of some kind and if I chased for perfection in all I would not have time to work to pay for them in the first place!!!
Put it in perspective and think of all the suffering, illnesses, death, fighting that is all around us now in our ever dying societies and world and here we are 'squabbling' over what is at the end of the day an immaterial thing.

I will except that if something is designed and is dangerous and risks lives then it deserves complaint, whether it be a product of £1 or £1000000 to buy, cost is not the issue.

I worked on the workshop floor for 14 years and worked my way from 'the boy' to foreman. I saw it all.....lists as long as your arm with what customers would think were faults, i spent days and days fixing squeaks rattles and millions of other silly little problems on Renaults. In comparison with renault to honda, well they are in a different league. Renaults are dreadful cars.
ALL manufactures have slipped in build quality, it is the doing of accountants who now run most firms, if they can save a few pound here and there at a compromise of quality then they will do it!!!!!! Trust me.

I have learned to except that nothing is perfect and what ever you buy will have a fault/problem of some kind. That includes a honda civic suspension and interior trim etc.....To be honest the next generation of cars will probably be even worse....more and more technology to go wrong crammed into a metal/plastic box on wheels

What is not exceptable is dealer attitudes, to sum that up is easy . Pay peanuts...get monkeys. The motor trade does not pay good money so that is why most dealers struggle with quality. I have worked with some right muppets in my time that took no pride in what they did, it was just a means to pay the bills..........

Rant over, thanks for listening. If anything that I have written has offended anyone then I apologise now. What I have written is my opinion on things.....

Regards Pumatron.

[geoff]

Right
I have read all of the comments and it now seems that you must not expect the top of the range honda with all the extras to work

You pay good money and hard earned to a crap dealer which when you complain he tells you I didn't make it

I was also told if you don't like it take us to court as with honda's backing and money you won't beat us

This thread was about huk and as far as my year with dealing with them it is something i wouldn't wish on anybody

So I am off now maybe in six months time I will repost and see how things are then

But in the meantime keep on doing Honda's Testing for them so they don't have to spend there money

If they had spent more time testing the civic and less time on stupid adverts maybe things would of been better

[Topcat]

Originally Posted by Hartside

jeez.......some people!

I agree totally - some people!!

It is a sad fact that if you moan on this forum you are shot down by all the people that will not have a bad word said against Honda.

Another fact is that whilst the people suffering problems may seem like a small few out of the 6000+ members on this forum that would be because many of those members do not even visit this forum anymore and havent done so for a long time probably because they no longer own the car, I know of many who have had problems and never mentioned it and some that got rid of the car without mentioning it and one who even managed to get his money back but did not want to make it public on here and left quietly. When a poll is carried out it has very small response considering the amount of members registered here.

I have said before one or two teething problems is acceptable maybe even expected on a new model but the civic (some more than others seems) to have been built with a pile of reject parts.

Pumatron is wrong if everything is built poorly these days why do the people I know who have had new cars in the last 18 months never had a problem? Why do they think my civic is a joke and I should get rid of it?

Geoff - you were always good at causing an arguement

[cb550]

Having unloaded my last Alfa because of niggles and faults, and at a fair old cost to the pocket,I can appreciate how the disatisfied owners here must be feeling.As someone already said, it's not what you would expect when buying into the Honda brand name.

For the record,Whoever buys my 06 Ctdi ES I've px/d for a type S will find themselves with a trouble free great running motor car (well,has been in the 6 months I've had it)

[Cad]

Originally Posted by Topcat

I agree totally - some people!!

It is a sad fact that if you moan on this forum you are shot down by all the people that will not have a bad word said against Honda.

It does seem that way, but there also seems to be an underlying message that the Honda Civic is the 'least worse' rather than the 'best' going by some of the more bizarre posts in this thread.

I refuse to accept that one should expect faults when buying a car (I bet it was a car salesman who dreamed that gem up!) and would instead prod people into realising that accepting faulty products will only encourage manufacturers to produce more.

Some People... indeed!

[geoff]

Originally Posted by Topcat

I agree totally - some people!!

It is a sad fact that if you moan on this forum you are shot down by all the people that will not have a bad word said against Honda.

Another fact is that whilst the people suffering problems may seem like a small few out of the 6000+ members on this forum that would be because many of those members do not even visit this forum anymore and havent done so for a long time probably because they no longer own the car, I know of many who have had problems and never mentioned it and some that got rid of the car without mentioning it and one who even managed to get his money back but did not want to make it public on here and left quietly. When a poll is carried out it has very small response considering the amount of members registered here.

I have said before one or two teething problems is acceptable maybe even expected on a new model but the civic (some more than others seems) to have been built with a pile of reject parts.

Pumatron is wrong if everything is built poorly these days why do the people I know who have had new cars in the last 18 months never had a problem? Why do they think my civic is a joke and I should get rid of it?

Geoff - you were always good at causing an arguement

Who me cause a Arguement!

Well I Loading the caravan and hitching up to the Boring Touran and off to the Sun

Happy Moaning everyone

[Koen]

Originally Posted by Topcat

I agree totally - some people!!

It is a sad fact that if you moan on this forum you are shot down by all the people that will not have a bad word said against Honda.

Another fact is that whilst the people suffering problems may seem like a small few out of the 6000+ members on this forum that would be because many of those members do not even visit this forum anymore and havent done so for a long time probably because they no longer own the car, I know of many who have had problems and never mentioned it and some that got rid of the car without mentioning it and one who even managed to get his money back but did not want to make it public on here and left quietly. When a poll is carried out it has very small response considering the amount of members registered here.

I have said before one or two teething problems is acceptable maybe even expected on a new model but the civic (some more than others seems) to have been built with a pile of reject parts.

Pumatron is wrong if everything is built poorly these days why do the people I know who have had new cars in the last 18 months never had a problem? Why do they think my civic is a joke and I should get rid of it?

Geoff - you were always good at causing an arguement

Since "some people" is me, I think I better reply on this.

1. I never ment to insult anyone, I just give my opinion on things I read troughout the whole forum. Besides that, english is not my native tongue, so sometimes things may not quite come across.
2. If you really had to go back 10+ times for urgent matters, you either have a lousy dealer or a really bad monday-machine.
3. I drive lots of different cars, as for my job I have to rely on "pool-cars" that are available in the car park here. That includes alfa's, VW, ford, fiats, opels/vauxhalls,volvos...you name it! The only car that really tempted me over a honda is a BMW. But to be honest: to much euro's for to little. So after 19 years of honda I recently got another honda.
4. Overall (hence the polls) most people are satisfied with their civic. But there's allways list and argue about what is wrong. No-one ever makes lists about what is good. But that's human I guess...
5. Bottom line, from where I stand, you can't go around one conclusion: Honda UK s*cks, and so do some (?) dealers. I cannot understand that Honda neglects this forum. Have there ever been official responses from them? If I was at the Honda UK Marketing dept I would consider it a major professional mistake not to take in account everything that goes on in this forum. More than 5700 members, mostly UK customers (ok, some not to active), that's a pretty good "critical mass".

As usual, just my opnion. If I offended someone (again) I'm already sorry for that!

K.

[geoff]

Koen

I have spoken to HUK lots of times and they just treat the customers as joke

when honda had lots of customers complaining they just hired more staff at the call centre

And they think this website is a joke because we doing all there testing for free

I expect i have upset pottsy again

[Cad]

Originally Posted by geoff

Koen

I have spoken to HUK lots of times and they just treat the customers as joke

when honda had lots of customers complaining they just hired more staff at the call centre

And they think this website is a joke because we doing all there testing for free

I expect i have upset pottsy again

If it wasn't for this website we wouldn't be half as informed as we are now.

Having a rant is OK... getting hysterical is just embarrassing for all concerned.

[Pumatron]

Ok, everyone. If you would like to go and hand your notices into your employer, if your self employed close your business.
All done that, good stuff

Right now go and get yourself a job at a main dealer for 6 months, does not matter about what manufacture you have picked or the job you got....ok who's the cleaner then.....

Now, at the end of that 6 months of hard toil and labour you will realise that no matter the product they ALL have problems....big and small. You see the same customers come in with problems and go out with problems...then you see customers come in with no problems and go out with problems. You will have also quite a few satified customers who never have a problem...its a mass produced world, if you spent a fortune on a car then ok you expect to be ok, but please be prepared for problems they are built in as standard........I bet they are millions of cars in the world with problems it is just that the person driving does not know they are there.

I have owned the following manufacture's vehicles
Austin
Renault
Ford
Citroen
Seat
Mazda
Lexus
Fiat
BMW
Honda

All over the past 15 years, they ALL had problems, FIAT, AUSTIN, RENAULT, BMW being the worst, i have learned to except if I pay £800 to £16000 it don't make a blind bit of difference to if it goes wrong or not.
My civic has had problems just like the most of us have, I just no longer shout it from the tree tops as experience has told me NO ONE cares.

If something has a problem and it can't be fixed I either live with it or sell it.

Oh, yes the comment about civic owners be guinee pigs for Honda's testing. very true, BUT that goes without saying for ALL manufactures, they all do it, Renault deffo does
It just depends where they are with there testing to how well your vehicle will perform. The first Renault Safrane's were absolute rubbish, terrible, terrible cars always going wrong........the last ones built....all ok...a few problems but generally they were good reliable cars.

Its life.........

Regards Pumatron

[Pottsy]

Pumatron, good stuff.

It's worth adding that different customers have wildly different skill levels when it comes to facilitating the correction of fixable faults.

[HumberMart]

Our views are always tainted by how much we 'love' a brand.

Having owned 7 Honda bikes, and 10 Honda cars (most from new) over the last 34 years, I'm obviously a big fan of the brand. But it has been based upon their usually faultless reliability and good build, as well as Honda's race bread culture and high tech ethos.

The only problem I've ever had with a Honda was a camshaft replacement in a Mk2 Prelude, that was a known fault accepted by Honda. My current CRV is on 59,000 miles and has never ever missed a beat or broken in any way. My SGT is only weeks old and 2,500 miles, but at the moment has demonstrated the usual Honda reliability, although I have some reservations about the build quality compared with the 'norm' I have grown to expect from Honda.

I do agree that many Honda dealers are very poor, although i've found most other brands similar or worse.

I've had 3 new BMW's recently, and never quite loved them as much as the Honda's I've had, but for no logical reason. They just leave me a bit 'cold', despite the premuim build quality and 'german' functionality. I've never been 100% happy with them though in build terms. The new 520D had paint laquer peeling off all the plastic bits after 6 months. The Z4 vibrated and buzzed at idle.

The TT I had was better than the BM's, IMHO, but TT's are well known for unreliable electrics etc.

It will be a shame if the new Civic tarnishes Honda's reputation. I'm sure it not right to blame the British build, most CRV's like mine, seem fine.

[Jack The Lad.]

As for doing their testing for them for free.
Are not the owners of 90% of the worlds computers operating on Windows, doing that very thing for Bill Gates. ?

[Hartside]

Pumatron, your take on life is exactly the same as my Honda dealer! (but £18,000 is a fortune to me!)

[TTDegs]

Originally Posted by HumberMart

The TT I had was better than.... but TT's are well known for unreliable electrics etc.

this is very true.

I (and possibly you HumberMart? ) was a member of the TT Owners Club and the TT-Forum for many years.

In July 2003, one of the more vocal members of the forum had his dashpod fail (the bit that contains all the dials etc and includes the clever electronic trickery) - his was by no means the first, but at £650 a go, he decided to do something about it, and started a list of owners with failures. This ran to hundreds of replies.

Typical failures would result in completly inaccurate petrol guage readings (and was often mis-diagnosed as a fuel sender issue).

A seperate poll showed 50% of owners had had a failure (although on a small sample size), and a further 9% had had 2 or more failures


It took until Jan 2006 (yes, 2 and a half years) for Audi to admit that it was a design fault - despite releasing an updated and improved version in 2004.

The issue ended up on WatchDog
and also a class action in the US.


Incidentally, Audi also refused to acknowledge the existence of the TT-Forum (currently 20,000 registered and over 1 million threads) - and when owners reported the issue to their dealers, the response was usually "oh - never heard of that before..."

To be fair, Audi did recognise the TT Owners Club though, and we were instrumental in sorting out the issues they (Audi) had with early DSG gearboxes.

(who mentioned unpaid testers? )



Does this make Honda any better? Nope.

Does it show that it is not only Honda who build to a price? You betcha

[Munro]

It is entirely normal for the first year of a new Car Models life to expose faults (a few minor ones) and be an unofficial development period for Car manufacturers. If the manufacturers did this final development before releasing the car, we would probably be paying 50% more for our cars.

A way round this is to not buy cars on their first release and wait a year or two until the teething problems are fixed and the car proven. It also has the advantage of not paying premium prices for the latest model, and often getting good discounts.

Most Modern cars are now very long lasting and durable, even new models. Honda is better than most as can be seen from the JD power survey results.

[HumberMart]

Yes, TT I used the forum, but never got around to joining the club, since after 8 months of fun with the TTR, I had to swap it for the diesel BMW due to the need to do lots of business miles and the employer not letting me use a 2 seat roadster on their milage scheme.

My 05 TT was fault free, but had only done 10K by the time I traded it. However I only lost £3.5K on it. Whereas I lost £7K (again in 8 months, though 20,000 miles) on the 520D when I later swapped it for the Z4 (after chaging employers!) and £6K on the Z4 after 6 months, 6000 miles. (after it got the better of my back) - BTW I think the SGT has the best seats of any car I've had, much better than the new 5 series, although I miss the electric adjustement).

My wife only lost £3K on a Jazz in 2 years, and 35,000 miles, so I'm hoping for better residuals from the SGT than the BM's (just glad it's an 07 model!)