1 Year on and even the new Subaru WRX STi don't compare!

[Mr JP]

Hi folks, it's been one year since I got my R-GT, see pics below...

After cleaning her thoroughly (pics below) I went out and passed my local Scooby dealer and thought I would have a go of the new "WRX STi" and here's what I thought...

First impressions are everything and although this new sti is an improvement over the old one, in terms of visuals it still looks out dated and behind in terms of appeal against the type-r.

Inside much the same, an improvement on its outgoing ancestor but drab and dreary in comparison to the cockpit of the Boeing type-r!

The salesman (actually dealer owner) got in the back allowing me to take the drive on a mixture of A-roads, B-roads and motorway for about 45mins.

He told me it has 300bhp, equivalent to the old sti with prodrive pack, and boy does it show!

After you have managed to engage the clutch, which feels too heavy and clunky, it's relatively soft until 3500-4000rpm until a big wallop of that power and torque all comes at once and it does impress but you find yourself disappointed that the revs run out at 6500+



It certainly is not as fun to drive as the civic and sounds nowhere near as good unless you like the constant "diff" wine. It feels heavier than the civic and seems to roll more on corners although the AWD does mean endless grip.

In the end the extra £7k over my civic or £9k over standard GT spec seems pricey for what you get, I’m in no doubt it performs very well but as a newly designed car in this price range did not feel a class above my "R", made most clear by poor build quality and doors sounding more "tinny" when closed than the civic.

Although I acknowledge my civic does have its faults (fog lights smashing, loose tweeter housings etc) it still brings a smile ear to ear and makes my pulse race 1 year on.

Would I trade it in for this Sti or any of the other turbo-charged, lazy driver, rival hot hatches?

Would I heck!

[Chalks]

You've been reading CAR magazine !

In the May issue they said exactly the same.

In 4 years I clocked up 80K in a Jap STi 5 Type-R with 308 BHP on tap and it did not instill the same level of confidence that I get today in my CTR. Balls out straight line acceleration was in fast jet territory but on twisty back roads in the real world the CTR just nails it. Fills every sense with what you need to drive fast.

What happened to the scooby ? Big end number four failed - engine rebuild required......apparently they don't go on forever.

[Mr JP]

Not read the CAR magazine but will have to try and find a copy now!

For anyone interested I don't think my photos were showing before but Pottsy has sorted them out so you can see my clean car against the new "STI"

[Rich 11]

Thats nice and comforting to know , makes me feel like I made the right choice.
Ps why are there police cars in the background ??..........

[gjackson]

Chalk/ cheese I wouldn't say the two cars are aimed at the same market.

[illegalhunter]

The Subaru is a stinker style wise.

[angie4m]

I see a guyu every day in the STi 08 plate, in blue with the gold alloys and WOW!!!!! I would seriously consider one of them next time round.........but by then they will have stopped selling it due to the cost of petrol lol!!!

[Mr JP]

gjackson, I would agree which is what my post is all about, although the Subaru is in a higher price bracket and aimed at the serious performance car market I feel, performance aside, the new "sti" does not feel like a newly designed 21st century car and lacks style.

angie, interestingly enough the economy figures are quite surprising on the new Subaru, I was averaging 27.4mpg on my test drive and was by no means holding back. I even joked with the sales guy that it might be broke lol!

On a separate note, I do feel manufacturers are missing a trick not making a Hot hatch in our price range (not 1 series "M" version) rear wheel drive, I mean look at the astra vxr and mazda 3 mps, both slated in the press for not being able to put all the power on the road. And again the forthcoming new focus RS reportedly to have 280-300bhp but ford have scrapped their original plans for rear wheel drive!

[gjackson]

Ford SVT in the US made a Mk1 Focus with the Mustang drive train for a show piece.

I know what you're saying. The Ralliart Lancer will be intereting if that ever arrives. Supposedly 220bhp DSG box and EVO 9 4wd system. Still not rear wheel drive but fun for 20K.

Another intereting car coming out is the Fiesta ST. The new Fiesta is based the Mazda 2 which is praised as having the feel of an old school light weight hatch.

I purposely avoided test driving a Type R in case I liked it but having driven a Clio 197 I think the modern family hatch is too lardy for the high revving race style engine.

[Mr JP]

mmmmn, clio 197 is nice, but definitely not what I would describe as high revving, + the type - r is the lightest of the hot hatches so i read, and thus slightly makes up for the loss of bhp (although there is evidence of type - r being 210bhp+ on dynos anyway)

and if it's a high revving race bred normally aspirated type - r engine or an average engine with turbo bolted on to cheat power figures, well you know what I drive

the focus ST for instance, a Volvo lump, turbo charged, 5 cylinders... 225bhp... in my mind greatly under tuned.

in my opinion manufacturers do not show engineering class or skill by bolting a big fan (turbo) to an otherwise ordinary engine.

Might be an age thing perhaps too, I'm only 22 (got my R at 21) and maybe when I'm middle aged the "lazy" less gear changing turbo's might suit but for now I'll stick to my light, high revving, instant throttle response!

[Mark996]

I test drove a 'Type UK' yesterday.....for those interested Subaru in Beeston, Notts has one IDENTICAL to the pic below for test drives....

It looked stunning on the big alloys.....a million times better than the standard STi...

As said before, the engine was awesome...and the 'sport' mode, selectable from the iDrive-type system actually DOES something that even mear mortals can feel!!

Gotta say though, same as the old one, but not to such a great extent, the interior is still woeful compared to the Civic....the clocks and stereo in particular are crap.....as I said, gorgeous on the outside though!

[f.ss.t]

i have a type s, and went down with my friend in his scooby to the nuremburg ring 3 months ago... on the way, his intercooler messed up haha
gutted... hondas all the way!

[Mr JP]

mark996, admitidly I do like that photo, and the wheels are nice too. I think the colour must make all the difference because my test one was a dreary silver.

Your point about the "idrive" system is also a valid one, something I didn't mention in my review above was that. The "i" mode being economy mode, then "sport" then "sport sharp". Apparantly the sport mode splits power 60% to front wheels and 40% to rear and "sport sharp" 20% front and 80% rear ideal for tracks etc.

Nice car but if sheer speed is the main buying reason, equally fast (and dull) cars can be had for half the money!

This is the same reason I didn't use my £20k+ to buy an old Supra or Nissan Pulsar, because I want style and something thats nice and fun to drive as well as reliable (so not ford or vauxhall)

[Mark996]

Yep JP, I'll go with most of that too....

Although as a past owner of a Focus ST-3, I'd have to dispute your comment 'bout Fords.....I genuinely miss my ST - it was a bullet, and an awesome drive....

I agree with you that the majority of Ford products are mundane and droll, but the ST really is the exception...especially when I had the pleasure of test-driving the Code:Red converted 285BHP ST

That was stupid quick....and thinking back actually felt MUCH faster than the new Impreza....

[Mr JP]

Each to their own I guess, so what made you get rid of the focus and get an "R" mate?

[dinoc]

It's got nothing to do with torque being split front/rear, the "I", "S" and "S#"
just makes the throttle less or more responding.

However, you can split torque rear/front manually using the Control Central Differential ... but we don't know exactly how much, I found somewhere saying 50:50 to 59:41 rear/front

Anyway it's a tottaly different car in a different league , it has 3 differentials ( helical front, torsen rear and multi-plate central - where the Euro Civic has none ), rear double-whishbone suspension , monster torque and power, forged BBS wheels, Brembo brakes, and more ... you just can't compare this two cars.

I've drove one, stock it's a pretty friendly car , it's more comfortable than Civic , it has some body-roll .
The most annoying thing was the zero feedback feeling of the steering wheel.

Anyway with some aftermarket upgrades you can transform this into a beast .

Originally Posted by Mr JP

Your point about the "idrive" system is also a valid one, something I didn't mention in my review above was that. The "i" mode being economy mode, then "sport" then "sport sharp". Apparantly the sport mode splits power 60% to front wheels and 40% to rear and "sport sharp" 20% front and 80% rear ideal for tracks etc.

[Mr JP]

the point was it ain't worth the extra dollar! to me anyway.

like I say it's good performance but they should have done more with the design/styling/build quality and poor interior.

Don't get me wrong if I could have that engine in my type-r I would, but I wouldn't take anything else.

[Mark996]

Originally Posted by Mr JP

Each to their own I guess, so what made you get rid of the focus and get an "R" mate?

I started working further away from home for a bit, and the fuel was killing me, so I swapped it in for a Mondeo ST Diesel......which wasn't actually THAT much better than the Focus ST on fuel in the 'real world'!!!

I was left very disappointed that i had gotten shot of the Focus ST too hastily - but at the same time didn't want to get something I'd already had - so I went for the Type R.....

I'm glad I did now, as the more I see on the road, the more I think the ST isn't actually aging THAT well....when I see another Type R or Astra VXR (especially in THAT blue they do!) they still both look really 'fresh' and different...the Focus just doesn't.....

Of course, I'll change my mind completely when the 'RS' is released!! YES PLEASE!!!!

[Mr JP]

having test driven both, I couldnt really separate the two in terms of speed, although torque wise the st seemed to have it come all at once which gave the "kick" effect.

How was it in the real world against the "R"?

[Mark996]

Urmmm....I'm finding the fuel consumption pretty similar to be honest - power wise, I think you're spot on - the ST 'feels' much quicker than the R probably down to that Turbo and the torque, but I wouldn't be surprised that if you timed them both like for like on a set course, they'd be pretty similar results.

As I said before mate, the interior of the R is streets ahead of the ST (and just about everything really!!), and that's what I've gone for - I don't care that the old model Type R is quicker....mine is a MUCH nicer place to have to sit everyday, and lets face it, we're not in a gung-ho, mentalist, drive like a nutter mood everyday are we!!?!?!

It's worth mentioning that other than the superb Code:Red 285BHP converted ST I tested, Code:Red also do a 315BHP version (albeit for £5000!!)....that must be just mental, and to be honest, without 4 wheel drive, I don't think the FWD would cope very well at all....my standard ST-3 used to torque-steer pretty bad when you gave it the beans from the lights....