M-factory Final Drive

[Dave84]

Hi was wondering if anyone has done this mod to their Fn2. Been thinking about this lately just wondering what the pros and cons are?

Been thinking about increasing the acceleration on my FN2 and herd this mod gives this car 15% increased torque making it good value for money instead of going down the n/a modding root which is highly expensive.

My engine is completely standard so far just wanted to know what you guys think. Herd this will reduce your top speed but I don’t plan on going 146mph anytime soon but would like the extra torque. My car is a daily driver and planning on the occasional track day next year.

What do you guys think to this mod?


MFactory Competition Products - Forged Transmission Components

[allagios]

do not do that without flashpro if you want to have correct ecu & dash speed readings.

[delta0]

Your rpm at all speeds will be higher. Worth baring in mind when you say you are daily driving.

[DPG87]

It's a great mod but I wouldn't put it on a stock car tbh

[TEGIWA IMPORTS]

Luke has the 5.46 in his EP3, its wild!

[DPG87]

Originally Posted by TEGIWA IMPORTS

Luke has the 5.46 in his EP3, its wild!

That's what I've ordered

[Ash101]

What is this?

[TEGIWA IMPORTS]

One of these

MFACTORY FINAL DRIVE GEAR HONDA CIVIC K20Z

[tdi-north]

Originally Posted by Dave84

Been thinking about increasing the acceleration on my FN2 and herd this mod gives this car 15% increased torque making it good value for money instead of going down the n/a modding root which is highly expensive.

Sorry. Struggling to get my head around this and advertising hype.

Anyone care to explain how a FD will actually increase a motors torque?

A motor will only produce so much power/torque and that is at the flywheel. Adding something after that point won't suddently make any more power out of the engine.

Changing the FD effectively shifts the power band from any given rev point further up the torque curve. Yeah thats right but you need to actually look at your curve in the first place and on an NA K20 motor your torque is actually dropping off. Certainly worth doing on a supercharged motor but downside is its also going to rev out quicker and in reality you could actually do with longer ratio FD to make full use of the power and get better mpg out of the setup.

Different FD will actually mean the engine is running faster to maintain same mph as before so mpg will suffer. Basically your max possible speed is reduced.

Don't get me wrong they are a great mod especially on a track car where your not going to be ever realistically using 6th so you can get the car to max out at 120 but on a roadcar that doesn't see a track, is a daily commuter probably doing a fair mileage and you think your going to get an easy power hike you really need to do a little more research.

[DPG87]

Originally Posted by tdi-north

Sorry. Struggling to get my head around this and advertising hype.

Anyone care to explain how a FD will actually increase a motors torque?

A motor will only produce so much power/torque and that is at the flywheel. Adding something after that point won't suddently make any more power out of the engine.

Changing the FD effectively shifts the power band from any given rev point further up the torque curve. Yeah thats right but you need to actually look at your curve in the first place and on an NA K20 motor your torque is actually dropping off. Certainly worth doing on a supercharged motor but downside is its also going to rev out quicker and in reality you could actually do with longer ratio FD to make full use of the power and get better mpg out of the setup.

Different FD will actually mean the engine is running faster to maintain same mph as before so mpg will suffer. Basically your max possible speed is reduced.

Don't get me wrong they are a great mod especially on a track car where your not going to be ever realistically using 6th so you can get the car to max out at 120 but on a roadcar that doesn't see a track, is a daily commuter probably doing a fair mileage and you think your going to get an easy power hike you really need to do a little more research.

That was where I was going with not putting it onto a stock car, I'm happy to drop mpg on a car that will be getting a charger and only gets used for weekend fun, but daily, I wouldn't, it's hard to describe I suppose because torque isn't actually increased, but I suppose more available would be the best way to describe it, it's a good mod to do tho especially if changing out the clutch and doing diff since your in there anyway, worth considering.

Or we could just get a turbo

[tdi-north]

Originally Posted by DPG87

That was where I was going with not putting it onto a stock car, I'm happy to drop mpg on a car that will be getting a charger and only gets used for weekend fun, but daily, I wouldn't, it's hard to describe I suppose because torque isn't actually increased, but I suppose more available would be the best way to describe it, it's a good mod to do tho especially if changing out the clutch and doing diff since your in there anyway, worth considering.

Or we could just get a turbo

Thats the thing. The factory ratio's are good for an NA car giving good power band through the gears and a longer 6th for cruising.
Go boosted and your find you actually need longer gears as your through 1-3 so quickly they are pointless.

Cheaper and better option alround is to actually put 17" wheels on. Has same effect as shorter ratio's, plus a lot lighter which will also improve acceleration, more tire sidewall which generates better cornering grip and lastly tires are a lot cheaper!

[DPG87]

Originally Posted by tdi-north

Thats the thing. The factory ratio's are good for an NA car giving good power band through the gears and a longer 6th for cruising.
Go boosted and your find you actually need longer gears as your through 1-3 so quickly they are pointless.

Cheaper and better option alround is to actually put 17" wheels on. Has same effect as shorter ratio's, plus a lot lighter which will also improve acceleration, more tire sidewall which generates better cornering grip and lastly tires are a lot cheaper!

Cheers for the input Paul!

Do you guys not use a different FD on your TA FN2?

[tdi-north]

No. Still stock. The cars spinning out the corners as it is so last thing we want to do is make it worse. Have gone 17's though.

[delta0]

You get more torque to the wheels by changing the final drive. That is how it works. You accelerate faster in 1st than 2nd because the ratio between the engine speed and wheel speed is greater for 1st gear. If you change the final drive you increase this ratio further and increase the force that can be applied.

Also switching from an 18" to 17" has virtually no effect on the torque from the wheels.

225/40 R18 tyre height = 90.0 mm. Alloy wheel diameter = 457.2 mm. Therefore, tyre diameter = (90.0 x 2) + 457.2 = 637.2 mm
225/45 R17 tyre height = 101.25 mm. Alloy wheel diameter = 431.8 mm. Therefore, tyre diameter = (101.25 x 2) + 431.8 = 634.3 mm
0.46% increase in torque to wheels by using 17" instead of 18".

The weight advantage and moving the mass closer to the axle will benefit performance though.

[Lunar Tick]

Good points - but don't forget, you can run a 40 profile tyre on 17 inch rims, which will significantly lower the effective final drive

[delta0]

Originally Posted by Lunar Tick

Good points - but don't forget, you can run a 40 profile tyre on 17 inch rims, which will significantly lower the effective final drive

That will give you a 4.2% increase. That would be notable.

The CTR comes with a 5.06 final drive I believe. Increasing to 5.46 would increase it by 7.9%

[Relic]

This is torque at the wheels vs speed for a typical FN2
The 6 curves are gears 1-6.
Red is 5.5 diff
Green is 5.1 diff

The pdf shows the data and better pics if interested.

[Relic]

So in every gear the 5-5 is producing noticable more torque.
But the 5-1 can stay in gear longer ..so claws some of the advantage back.

Now if you had a 5-5 diff and upped the rpm limit to give you the same gear speeds as a 5-1....then you would obliterate a standard 5-1 FN2
You'd need about 7.8% more rpm than standard to do this.....

[pulpmelon_r]

Originally Posted by Relic

So in every gear the 5-5 is producing noticable more torque.
But the 5-1 can stay in gear longer ..so claws some of the advantage back.

Now if you had a 5-5 diff and upped the rpm limit to give you the same gear speeds as a 5-1....then you would obliterate a standard 5-1 FN2
You'd need about 7.8% more rpm than standard to do this.....

Now this is some good info!

[DPG87]

Originally Posted by Relic

So in every gear the 5-5 is producing noticable more torque.
But the 5-1 can stay in gear longer ..so claws some of the advantage back.

Now if you had a 5-5 diff and upped the rpm limit to give you the same gear speeds as a 5-1....then you would obliterate a standard 5-1 FN2
You'd need about 7.8% more rpm than standard to do this.....

So basically since I can rev to 8800-8900 rather than the stock 8400 I should in theory get the full benefit of the 5.46 FD