Tyre Choice I choose 16" instead of 17"

nico651 · 21st February 2008, 14:20

Hi all,

This is my very first post here...
I ordered my Civic 1.8 5-doors in Galaxy Grey a few days ago and have still to wait for 2 or 3 weeks before i can have it.
Based on the testdrive I did with the 2.2 diesel I decided to swap the 17" wheels for the 16" wheels of the 1.4 Sport. I'm not a big fan of the rather stiff suspension of the Civic and i hope the ride will be a bit more comfortable with the smaller wheels. Altough i know that a stiffer suspension results in a better roadholding...
I know it looks a lot nicer with the larger wheels so i wanted your advice if it will really make a difference or it's better to keep the 17" wheels.
I have still a few weeks to decide what to do. They don't return me any money. The only time I'll save a couple of bucks is when I need to renew the tyres...

pcr · 21st February 2008, 15:22

Most definitely, 16" wheels are noticeably more comfortable than 17". I would have done the same, If only I had realised at the time. It's not just comfort either, you will probable get 2mpg extra, less tramlining, more grip in the snow, possibly less tyre noise, and cheaper tyres.

Charley Farley · 21st February 2008, 15:27

Hi Nico651

I echo PCR's opinion. I tried the Civic with 16 and 17 inch wheels and there was a considerable improvement in ride quality and no discernable loss of road holding or handling.

Honcho · 21st February 2008, 16:21

Unfortunately Honda are still adamant that the 17'' on EX models must not be swapped for 16'', despite the clear improvement in ride. This, they say, is due to steering and braking problems, and would no doubt affect any warranty claim.

I know some have done it. But who's prepared to risk it?

Courant · 21st February 2008, 16:29

I emailed Honda UK asking whether I could fit 16" wheels to my type-s (for use with winter tyres) and they said the same thing, only the reason they gave was speedo calibration. Yet the tyre info plaque on the driver's door clearly states the 16" tyre size as an acceptable combination. If this is the case, then surely 16" are manufacturers specification and Honda would have a very hard time justifying any non-acceptance of a warranty claim?

If you want the comfort, the 16" is the way to go - this is simple physics, more air==more damping! For normal driving, I don't think you'd notice the difference in performance/handing.

Courant

Honcho · 21st February 2008, 17:17

I know we've been through this before, but there's definitely something odd going on here.

Why can't Honda get its story straight?

Is it or is it not possible/advisable to fit 16'' wheels to an EX? And if not, why not?

If Honda don't know, don't care, won't say, who will?

civicfan · 21st February 2008, 17:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honcho

Unfortunately Honda are still adamant that the 17'' on EX models must not be swapped for 16'', despite the clear improvement in ride. This, they say, is due to steering and braking problems, and would no doubt affect any warranty claim.

I know some have done it. But who's prepared to risk it?

A strange story if you ask me - I have 16" winter wheels dealer-fitted (steel), no problems

terry · 21st February 2008, 19:12

I thought the overall diameter of the wheel and tyre was the same, the 17" wheel has a lower profile tyre. So the speedo calibration is not much of an excuse.
I also thought you could upgrade an ES to have 17" wheels with no problems, so why you can't go backwards seems a bit peculiar. I can't believe there are different set-ups depending on the chosen wheel size!
Anyway, I chose the ES on the basis of the better ride.
Terry

ASH · 21st February 2008, 21:00

Owners manual says you can fit 16". So as the door sticker.
As long as you stick with the tyre size indicated(205/55/16), there is no problem.

Honcho · 21st February 2008, 21:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASH

Owners manual says you can fit 16". So as the door sticker.
As long as you stick with the tyre size indicated(205/55/16), there is no problem.

You'd think so, wouldn't you?

However, if you contact Honda they will adamantly insist that 16'' wheels must NEVER be fitted to the EX.

Ask them yourself!

So what's the answer?

Jack The Lad. · 21st February 2008, 21:18

Oh B-gger, thought I would be able to buy a new 17" from you nico.

civicfan · 21st February 2008, 21:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honcho

You'd think so, wouldn't you?

However, if you contact Honda they will adamantly insist that 16'' wheels must NEVER be fitted to the EX.

Ask them yourself!

So what's the answer?

If I got them and I'm still alive I'm afraid the answer is some Honda employee is an idiot

edit: or perhaps there is some series with bigger brake discs/calipers? that would be an explanation (maybe) ?

ASH · 21st February 2008, 21:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honcho

You'd think so, wouldn't you?

However, if you contact Honda they will adamantly insist that 16'' wheels must NEVER be fitted to the EX.

Ask them yourself!

So what's the answer?

It's on printed document issued bｙ Honda Motor, which is a much better argument than a non-recorded phone call with a call centre staff.

Honcho · 22nd February 2008, 10:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASH

It's on printed document issued bｙ Honda Motor, which is a much better argument than a non-recorded phone call with a call centre staff.

Agreed. However, when I made a fuss about it, the service manager of my Honda dealer, who was completely sympathetic, rang Honda Tech while I waited.

They told him not to do it. For brake disc and steering problems.

He couldn't do it after that, obviously. Not without affecting the warranty.

So I ask again. Why are Honda adamantly making this point? Not just once. Over and over again. To their dealers and to the public.

Is there perhaps some obscure technical possibility which might get them sued?

Could one of the engineering brains on this site perhaps opine?

Techsidekick · 22nd February 2008, 11:08

So what is the position for 18" wheels, the EX we bought was fitted with 18" Altimos, I assume I can't downgrade to 17" or 16" wheels. Think someones pulling a fast one. Surely someone technical from Honda can give a convincing answer !!

Honcho · 22nd February 2008, 11:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Techsidekick

So what is the position for 18" wheels, the EX we bought was fitted with 18" Altimos, I assume I can't downgrade to 17" or 16" wheels. Think someones pulling a fast one. Surely someone technical from Honda can give a convincing answer !!

I mentioned this.

Honda said that it was quite permissible to go up to 18'' wheels, or down from them to 17'' wheels.

But never down to 16'' wheels from whatever size.

The problem is, people from Honda technical HAVE given an answer. Several times.

It's just that it isn't convincing and contradicts their own written word.

Someone on this site with engineering experience must surely have an opinion....and an explanation as to why Honda seem to be playing some kind of game.

I'm simply not qualified to do it.

allan40alt · 22nd February 2008, 12:08

It's a thinner width tyre, so less grip, I would imagine. 225 on the 17", 205 on the 16" .

The wider the tyre the better for safety, especially in the wet.

civicfan · 22nd February 2008, 12:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honcho

I mentioned this.

Honda said that it was quite permissible to go up to 18'' wheels, or down from them to 17'' wheels.

But never down to 16'' wheels from whatever size.

The problem is, people from Honda technical HAVE given an answer. Several times.

It's just that it isn't convincing and contradicts their own written word.

Someone on this site with engineering experience must surely have an opinion....and an explanation as to why Honda seem to be playing some kind of game.

I'm simply not qualified to do it.

Me neither, but how come I have 16" winter wheels, from the dealer? Maybe it's possible then for steel but not alloy wheels? I just don't get it...

allan40alt · 22nd February 2008, 12:53

Honda would not recommend a narrower tyre for a more powerful engine.

Narrow tyre = less grip. That's probably why the 'space saver' spare has a recommended top speed of 50mph.

Courant · 22nd February 2008, 13:00

Interesting. Just visited the swiss Honda site (me being half swiss!), and they have 16" tyres listed as an official Honda accessory for the Type-S (page 5):

http://www.honda.ch/hondashop/html/p...71708_9_07.pdf

Same with Honda Germany:

Honda | Automobile | Zubehör

Same car from swindon. Honda UK, go figure! I'll be fitting 16" wheels next winter, come what may.

Courant

21st February 2008, 14:20	#1 (permalink)
nico651 Supporter Valve Cap Join Date: 17th February 2008 Location: Denderleeuw, BE Posts: 39 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: (0)	I choose 16" instead of 17" Hi all, This is my very first post here... I ordered my Civic 1.8 5-doors in Galaxy Grey a few days ago and have still to wait for 2 or 3 weeks before i can have it. Based on the testdrive I did with the 2.2 diesel I decided to swap the 17" wheels for the 16" wheels of the 1.4 Sport. I'm not a big fan of the rather stiff suspension of the Civic and i hope the ride will be a bit more comfortable with the smaller wheels. Altough i know that a stiffer suspension results in a better roadholding... I know it looks a lot nicer with the larger wheels so i wanted your advice if it will really make a difference or it's better to keep the 17" wheels. I have still a few weeks to decide what to do. They don't return me any money. The only time I'll save a couple of bucks is when I need to renew the tyres...

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This thread is about: I choose 16" instead of 17", it's in Wheels, Tyres, Suspension and Brakes at the Honda Civic forum Civinfo; Hi all, This is my very first post here... I ordered my Civic 1.8 5-doors in Galaxy Grey a few days ago and have still ...

21st February 2008, 15:22	#2 (permalink)
pcr Magic Rear Seat Join Date: 5th September 2006 Location: Shropshire Posts: 848 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader: (0)	Most definitely, 16" wheels are noticeably more comfortable than 17". I would have done the same, If only I had realised at the time. It's not just comfort either, you will probable get 2mpg extra, less tramlining, more grip in the snow, possibly less tyre noise, and cheaper tyres.

21st February 2008, 15:27	#3 (permalink)
Charley Farley Triangular Exhaust Join Date: 25th September 2006 Location: Greenford West London Posts: 488 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: (0)	Hi Nico651 I echo PCR's opinion. I tried the Civic with 16 and 17 inch wheels and there was a considerable improvement in ride quality and no discernable loss of road holding or handling.

21st February 2008, 16:21	#4 (permalink)
Honcho Supporter Triangular Exhaust Join Date: 5th October 2006 Posts: 274 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts iTrader: (0)	Unfortunately Honda are still adamant that the 17'' on EX models must not be swapped for 16'', despite the clear improvement in ride. This, they say, is due to steering and braking problems, and would no doubt affect any warranty claim. I know some have done it. But who's prepared to risk it?

21st February 2008, 16:29	#5 (permalink)
Courant Locking Wheelnut Join Date: 27th January 2008 Location: Cambridge, UK Posts: 113 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader: (0)	I emailed Honda UK asking whether I could fit 16" wheels to my type-s (for use with winter tyres) and they said the same thing, only the reason they gave was speedo calibration. Yet the tyre info plaque on the driver's door clearly states the 16" tyre size as an acceptable combination. If this is the case, then surely 16" are manufacturers specification and Honda would have a very hard time justifying any non-acceptance of a warranty claim? If you want the comfort, the 16" is the way to go - this is simple physics, more air==more damping! For normal driving, I don't think you'd notice the difference in performance/handing. Courant

21st February 2008, 17:17	#6 (permalink)
Honcho Supporter Triangular Exhaust Join Date: 5th October 2006 Posts: 274 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts iTrader: (0)	I know we've been through this before, but there's definitely something odd going on here. Why can't Honda get its story straight? Is it or is it not possible/advisable to fit 16'' wheels to an EX? And if not, why not? If Honda don't know, don't care, won't say, who will?

21st February 2008, 19:12	#8 (permalink)
terry Supporter Triangular Exhaust Join Date: 24th September 2006 Location: Cambridge Posts: 332 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: (0)	I thought the overall diameter of the wheel and tyre was the same, the 17" wheel has a lower profile tyre. So the speedo calibration is not much of an excuse. I also thought you could upgrade an ES to have 17" wheels with no problems, so why you can't go backwards seems a bit peculiar. I can't believe there are different set-ups depending on the chosen wheel size! Anyway, I chose the ES on the basis of the better ride. Terry

21st February 2008, 21:00	#9 (permalink)
ASH Wheelnut Join Date: 29th September 2007 Location: London Posts: 84 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: (0)	Owners manual says you can fit 16". So as the door sticker. As long as you stick with the tyre size indicated(205/55/16), there is no problem.

21st February 2008, 21:18	#11 (permalink)
Jack The Lad. Supporter Rocketship door handle Join Date: 28th August 2007 Location: ENGLAND Posts: 1,764 Thanks: 2 Thanked 19 Times in 19 Posts iTrader: (0)	Oh B-gger, thought I would be able to buy a new 17" from you nico.

22nd February 2008, 11:08	#15 (permalink)
Techsidekick Valve Cap Join Date: 1st February 2008 Location: Dumfries,UK Posts: 9 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: (0)	So what is the position for 18" wheels, the EX we bought was fitted with 18" Altimos, I assume I can't downgrade to 17" or 16" wheels. Think someones pulling a fast one. Surely someone technical from Honda can give a convincing answer !!

22nd February 2008, 12:08	#17 (permalink)
allan40alt Supporter Civinfo guru Join Date: 6th August 2006 Location: Rugby, Warwickshire. Posts: 2,255 Thanks: 12 Thanked 33 Times in 31 Posts iTrader: (0)	It's a thinner width tyre, so less grip, I would imagine. 225 on the 17", 205 on the 16" . The wider the tyre the better for safety, especially in the wet.

22nd February 2008, 12:53	#19 (permalink)
allan40alt Supporter Civinfo guru Join Date: 6th August 2006 Location: Rugby, Warwickshire. Posts: 2,255 Thanks: 12 Thanked 33 Times in 31 Posts iTrader: (0)	Honda would not recommend a narrower tyre for a more powerful engine. Narrow tyre = less grip. That's probably why the 'space saver' spare has a recommended top speed of 50mph.

22nd February 2008, 13:00	#20 (permalink)
Courant Locking Wheelnut Join Date: 27th January 2008 Location: Cambridge, UK Posts: 113 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader: (0)	Interesting. Just visited the swiss Honda site (me being half swiss!), and they have 16" tyres listed as an official Honda accessory for the Type-S (page 5): http://www.honda.ch/hondashop/html/p...71708_9_07.pdf Same with Honda Germany: Honda \| Automobile \| Zubehör Same car from swindon. Honda UK, go figure! I'll be fitting 16" wheels next winter, come what may. Courant