Tyre Life replace or rotate? (split posts)

[TTDegs]

my front (18") Mich PS2s lasted about 12K miles
rears are virtually untouched though

Now got Goodyears on the front To early to say how long they're going to last though


I would say though, that the advice above are for relatively 'softer' tyres - ie more grip, but less mileage.

Which for me personally, is the way to go

But I can understand people who are looking for harder, longer wearing tyres

[alastair b]

Originally Posted by TTDegs

my front (18") Mich PS2s lasted about 12K miles
rears are virtually untouched though

Now got Goodyears on the front To early to say how long they're going to last though


I would say though, that the advice above are for relatively 'softer' tyres - ie more grip, but less mileage.

Which for me personally, is the way to go

But I can understand people who are looking for harder, longer wearing tyres

Wondering why you didn't change tyres round sooner,would have lasted longer.
I recommend the ps2's.

[TTDegs]

Originally Posted by alastair b

Wondering why you didn't change tyres round sooner,would have lasted longer.
I recommend the ps2's.

On the plus side, company car = company tyres

On the down side, company car = due to having to work my 'arris off to get the job that got the car, = no spare time to worry about changing tyres around
(see the times of 90% of my posts in here )

(and no, that's not me asking or looking for a sympathy vote LOL )

[Wander]

Originally Posted by TTDegs

On the down side, company car = due to having to work my 'arris off to get the job that got the car, = no spare time to worry about changing tyres around

Can't you get the dealer to do it for a few quid? I bet he won't mind getting some of your compagny's money

[TTDegs]

Originally Posted by Wander

Can't you get the dealer to do it for a few quid? I bet he won't mind getting some of your compagny's money

yes, probably could


to be honest though, whilst I can appreciate that there are benefits to tyre rotation, eventually you will have to replace them at some point.

Lets say fronts last 12K and rears 36K. And set tyre price at £150 each (just for round numbers). Costs below are running totals

Option 1 - no rotation, replace as worn out
12K - 2 x front £300
24K - 2 x front £600
36K - 2 x front + 2 x rear £1200
48K - 2 x front £1500
60K - 2 x front £1800
72K - 2 x front + 2 x rear £2400

Option 2 - rotate back to front when worn out. Assume 10K left in tyres @ move
12K - move back to front + 2 rear £300
22K - move back to front + 2 rear £600
32K - move back to front + 2 rear £900
42K - move back to front + 2 rear £1200
52K - move back to front + 2 rear £1500
62K - move back to front + 2 rear £1800
72K - move back to front + 2 rear £2100

so you've saved £300

and if you're doing the average 12K miles per year, that's £300 over 6 years.
which is about £5 per month.

and it assumes (probably correctly) that the tyre fitter will rotate the wheels for free when replacing the rears.
If they charge you £10 for rotating tho, that's £70 gone from your £300 saving

[sarahjo]

Wow TT what a font of information u are...how long did that take!!!

[czechplastik]

Originally Posted by sarahjo

Wow TT what a font of information u are...how long did that take!!!

Makes a good point! That's why he's a mod!

[sarahjo]

Originally Posted by czechplastik

Makes a good point! That's why he's a mod!

Yeah and what a mod he is...all hail the mods!!!!

[pcr]

TTDegs,
Well there's nothing on TV just now so excuse this sad response. I'm sure rotating tyres cannot save money as you describe, I think your figures are off. Why assume there is 10K left on rears at first rotation, I would have thought 8K ?
Seriously though, isn't the point of rotating tyres more to do with keeping good tyres on the front for longer?

[Andrea]

Thanks for your recommendations peeps. can we please keep it about what i am asking though and not get into a debate between yourselves about it, thats why the other tyre threads got confusing.

[sarahjo]

Andrea..we are not going off topic..actually we think..that is me and CZ ( hope u don't mind me speaking for u) think it is really great the TT has gone to all that trouble..personally i would have taken it to a garage and got them to replace what was already on my car!!

Don't jump to conclusions we are recognising the hard work of one of the key members of the site

[Power_of_Dreams]

agreeing with SJ on the aforementioned post...people are helping each other out and highlighting there good will isnt a bad thing, should be commended more often...as it should be with everything!

http://www.mytyres.co.uk/start.html

try here!

[Andrea]

Originally Posted by sarahjo

Andrea..we are not going off topic..actually we think..that is me and CZ ( hope u don't mind me speaking for u) think it is really great the TT has gone to all that trouble..personally i would have taken it to a garage and got them to replace what was already on my car!!

Don't jump to conclusions we are recognising the hard work of one of the key members of the site

I didnt say that i didnt appreciate his effort, im on about people getting into debates between themselves which makes the thread more difficult to read.
All im after is some recommendations, not for people to debate if rotating tyres is better than buying 4 new ones. and the post wasnt referring to you anyway SJ.

[TTDegs]

Originally Posted by pcr

TTDegs,
Well there's nothing on TV just now so excuse this sad response. I'm sure rotating tyres cannot save money as you describe, I think your figures are off. Why assume there is 10K left on rears at first rotation, I would have thought 8K ?

ok....

I went for 10K left because:
When I replace my front MPS2, at 12K, the tyres on the back still had over 6mm of tread left, from 7mm when new (they were hardly touched)
Replacing at 3mm, meant 4mm of tread had been used in 12Kmiles
so 1mm of tread = 3K miles
At over 6mm left on the rears, that would have meant 3+ times 3K miles, which gave me 10K left

Plus, 10K was a nice round number, which helped

Seriously though, isn't the point of rotating tyres more to do with keeping good tyres on the front for longer?

Er....It can be, if you start swapping tyres round in the middle of their life, not at the end


But that got a bit toooooo confusing for me to try and work out the costs for

I might have a go later

[apemonkeyman]

I always put the rears to the front & replace the rears... only 2 tyres to buy at any 1 time. Before I did this I used to replace whatever was worn out without rotation & ended up with the back tyres rotting before the tread had worn...

[Maldax]

Originally Posted by TTDegs

yes, probably could


to be honest though, whilst I can appreciate that there are benefits to tyre rotation, eventually you will have to replace them at some point.

Lets say fronts last 12K and rears 36K. And set tyre price at £150 each (just for round numbers). Costs below are running totals

Option 1 - no rotation, replace as worn out
12K - 2 x front £300
24K - 2 x front £600
36K - 2 x front + 2 x rear £1200
48K - 2 x front £1500
60K - 2 x front £1800
72K - 2 x front + 2 x rear £2400

Option 2 - rotate back to front when worn out. Assume 10K left in tyres @ move
12K - move back to front + 2 rear £300
22K - move back to front + 2 rear £600
32K - move back to front + 2 rear £900
42K - move back to front + 2 rear £1200
52K - move back to front + 2 rear £1500
62K - move back to front + 2 rear £1800
72K - move back to front + 2 rear £2100

so you've saved £300

and if you're doing the average 12K miles per year, that's £300 over 6 years.
which is about £5 per month.

and it assumes (probably correctly) that the tyre fitter will rotate the wheels for free when replacing the rears.
If they charge you £10 for rotating tho, that's £70 gone from your £300 saving

Not sure I agree with your maths there TT. I always thought that Tyre rotation was just that. You take the front ones to the back and the back ones to the front. Using your maths if you swap at say 6k the back with the front the old back ones will still have 9k's worth of tread left as front tyres and the old front ones will be up for 18k as back tyres. It then gets very complicated (Might knock up an Excel)

[pcr]

A different way of looking at it. Over it's lifetime, the car will leave the same amount of rubber on the road, regardless of rotation.

[apemonkeyman]

Originally Posted by pcr

A different way of looking at it. Over it's lifetime, the car will leave the same amount of rubber on the road, regardless of rotation.

Surely the rubber is left on the road because of rotation.

[alastair b]

Originally Posted by TTDegs

yes, probably could


to be honest though, whilst I can appreciate that there are benefits to tyre rotation, eventually you will have to replace them at some point.

Lets say fronts last 12K and rears 36K. And set tyre price at £150 each (just for round numbers). Costs below are running totals

Option 1 - no rotation, replace as worn out
12K - 2 x front £300
24K - 2 x front £600
36K - 2 x front + 2 x rear £1200
48K - 2 x front £1500
60K - 2 x front £1800
72K - 2 x front + 2 x rear £2400

Option 2 - rotate back to front when worn out. Assume 10K left in tyres @ move
12K - move back to front + 2 rear £300
22K - move back to front + 2 rear £600
32K - move back to front + 2 rear £900
42K - move back to front + 2 rear £1200
52K - move back to front + 2 rear £1500
62K - move back to front + 2 rear £1800
72K - move back to front + 2 rear £2100

so you've saved £300

and if you're doing the average 12K miles per year, that's £300 over 6 years.
which is about £5 per month.

and it assumes (probably correctly) that the tyre fitter will rotate the wheels for free when replacing the rears.
If they charge you £10 for rotating tho, that's £70 gone from your £300 saving

Nice one TT,based on your calculations,£300 would give me a years free insurance with change.
Keep up the good work.
Sorry Andrea.

[TTDegs]

ok.


time to bite the bullet and try to do the numbers with half worn rotations... *gulp*

First up, some assumptions:
tyres on the front wear at a rate of 1mm = 3K miles
tyres on the back wear at a rate of 1mm = 12k miles
tyres start with 7mm of tread
rotate tyres when front tread gets to 5mm ish
replace tyres at 3mm
pair of tyres = £300

6K - front = 2mm wear, down to 5mm. rear = 0.5mm wear, down to 6.5mm. rotate.
front now 6.5mm, rear 5mm. cost to date £0
12K - front = 2mm wear, down to 4.5mm. rear = 0.5mm wear, down to 4.5mm. no point in doing anything. cost to date £0
16.5k - front 1.5mm wear, down to 3mm. rear = 0.4mm wear, down to 4.1mm. replace fronts.
front now 7mm, rear 4.1mm. cost to date £300
22.5K - front = 2mm wear, down to 5mm. rear = 0.5mm wear, down to 3.6mm. no change. cost to date £300
28.5K - front = 2mm wear, down to 3mm. rear = 0.5mm wear, down to 3.1mm. replace front and rear.
front now 7mm, rear 7mm. cost to date £900

So, we're back to exactly where we started - new rubber all round, and we're at 28.5K miles.

double that distance, to save some typing
57k - front now 7mm, rear now 7mm. cost to date £1800
63K - front = 2mm wear, down to 5mm. rear = 0.5mm wear, down to 6.5mm. rotate.
front now 6.5mm, rear 5mm. cost to date £1800
69K - front = 2mm wear, down to 4.5mm. rear = 0.5mm wear, down to 4.5mm. no point in doing anything. cost to date £1800
73.5k - front 1.5mm wear, down to 3mm. rear = 0.4mm wear, down to 4.1mm. replace fronts.
front now 7mm, rear 4.1mm. cost to date £2100



so.

In option1, we did no rotating at all.
at 72K, we had paid out £2400, and had new tyres all round

In option2, we moved the back ones to the front when the fronts wore out.
at 72K, we had paid out £2100, and had new tyres up front, and virtually new ones at the back.

In option3, we rotated the tyres when they hit 5mm, and replaced at 3mm.
at 73.5k, we had paid out £2100, and had new tyres up front, but fairly worn ones (4.1mm left) at the back.

please feel free to spot any mistakes!

(or work out what happens if you rotate ever 3K miles )