Named driver insurance - fronting - (split thread) - Civinfo
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post #1 of 57 (permalink) Old 9th October 2006, 13:39 Thread Starter
 
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Named driver insurance - fronting - (split thread)

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Originally Posted by DanKo View Post
The mods on the car should'nt affect me that much I think, the car is on my dad's name (Cheaper insurance), so his will go up? not to sure, Il ask him.
On the first month on having this car, some old women went straight into the side of this car, and everything was sorted within a week.
I suspect in the case of the claim you mentioned above that it was all done through the insurance company of the 'old woman' and that your (or your Fathers insurance) were not involved.

The issue will come up if you try to claim on your insurance.
If it can also be proved that you are the main driver then you will not be insured. Putting it in your Fathers name to get cheaper insurance is a big risk for you both. This can only be done if you are not the main driver of the vehicle. If you are the main driver you must have your own insurance.

What you are doing is trying to cheat the insurers out of the money they are due for taking on the risk of you as a driver. If they find out (which they can do) that your drive the Civic the most, then you will not be insured.

You need to make sure that :-

1. The insurer is aware that you have made mods to the car, list everything that has been changed or added.

2. Make sure that the value of the vehicle stated to the insurer covers the full cost of the car and ALL the extras.

3. Make sure that the insurer knows that you are the primary driver (if you are).

Once you tell them all that they will either

Raise the premium to cover the additional risk and therefore showing that you would not have been covered if you had made a claim.

OR

Leave the premium as is and provide the cover requested (unlikely)

Ian
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post #2 of 57 (permalink) Old 9th October 2006, 13:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parky View Post
1. The insurer is aware that you have made mods to the car, list everything that has been changed or added.

2. Make sure that the value of the vehicle stated to the insurer covers the full cost of the car and ALL the extras.

3. Make sure that the insurer knows that you are the primary driver (if you are).
Not wanting to scare anybody; but there was a link (on here I THINK but maybe not) about a guy who was driving his car to a race, also a couple of other things he did wrong; posted it on a forum and the insurance company actually read the post and didn't give him the insurance because of this.
My Dad used to sell insurance too and the primary driver thing is a biggy; if your Dad has his own car and the Civic is a 2nd on his insurance; but has a lot of miles, then it's quite obvious, believe me they have ways of catching you out that you wouldn't imagine!
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post #3 of 57 (permalink) Old 9th October 2006, 18:02
 
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Im not the main driver, im just a listed driver on it. If the car was on my name only, the insurance wouldnt do it, the only way that I can drive this, is that my dad was the main driver, and I was a 2nd driver on it.
We didnt do this for cheap insurance, although, it works out cheaper anyways, but that's not the case.

Just spoke to my dad about it, He's told the insurance on all the mods, shame he didnt tell me this earlier.

The only thing's that he hasnt told is like the interior lights, that's about it.

Last edited by DanKo; 9th October 2006 at 18:09.
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post #4 of 57 (permalink) Old 9th October 2006, 23:13
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Danko, not wanting to ruin anything, but when I attempted to insure a car for my son when he was 17 one of the questons on the insurace proposal form was about who the 'Main driver' would be. As it was him the insurer would not accept me as the 'Main driver' and him as a 'Named driver'.

This may not sound like much but it could in the case of an accident cause the insurer to refuse to pay up. Of course they would have to prove who the 'Main driver' was I suppose.
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post #5 of 57 (permalink) Old 9th October 2006, 23:15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanKo View Post
Im not the main driver, im just a listed driver on it. If the car was on my name only, the insurance wouldnt do it, the only way that I can drive this, is that my dad was the main driver, and I was a 2nd driver on it.
Who mainly drives the car though? If it's you then that's fraud.
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post #6 of 57 (permalink) Old 9th October 2006, 23:16
 
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Originally Posted by generationgav View Post
Who mainly drives the car though? If it's you then that's fraud.
Dad drive's it more.
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post #7 of 57 (permalink) Old 9th October 2006, 23:18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parky View Post
Even upgrading the HiFi to a non standard spec can be seen as an increased risk by the insurer.
Most policies I have read limit the value on none standard HiFi's to about 100
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post #8 of 57 (permalink) Old 9th October 2006, 23:18
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by generationgav View Post
Who mainly drives the car though? If it's you then that's fraud.

This is common practice now though.

Kids buy expensive cars and cannot afford the insurance, so mum or dad have to do it for them. Not saying it is wrong, but just a fact anyway.
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post #9 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 08:31
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If your not the main driver, why does it have a Plate with your name?
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post #10 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 09:29
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Thing is, by doing this, you're also not building up no claims. Eventually you will have to fend for yourself and your insurance will be sky high!
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post #11 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 11:19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by basegreen View Post
Thing is, by doing this, you're also not building up no claims. Eventually you will have to fend for yourself and your insurance will be sky high!
Absolutely.
The named driver route is a complete waste of time if you wish to build no claims. The simple fact is you are not building any no claims right now and the first time you "go it alone" on insurance they will treat you as a first timer and premiums will reflect this, no matter how old you are at the time. They really won't car how many years you have been a "named driver" on someone elses policy.

As for the car being driven by your Dad more than you, but carrying a private plate with your name on? Good luck convincing the insurance on that one.
Don't wish to put the frighteners up you but......
They will have every right to beleive that the car with your name on the plate is your primary transport. They will also have a right to investigate fully (and they will) just how many miles your Dad drives and what other cars he has in his name. And at the end of the day, if your Dad has more than 1 car and you are insured as a second driver on one of them they have every right to beleive that you are the primary driver on that car (especially if you have no car of your own). They will look at the mods and make the assumption that you are primary driver and refuse to pay out, you will then need to prove deyond a shadow of doubt that you dont drive the car much, pretty much un-win-able that one. If worst came to the worst a simple test they could do would be to take the millage of any other car your Dad is named on the insurance of, add it to the Civic milleage and then subtract from that figure his claimed annual milleage. If there is a discrepency of miles un-accoundted for (even 1000miles) he will have to confirm to them where those miles came from before they would even need to consider paying out.
Needless to say if this happens they could prosocute you dad for insurance fraud with ease.
In fact It's not un-common for insurance companies to employ private detective firms to find out as much info as possible before making payment, they dont even have to be sceptical. Anything to save themselves money will be utilised (You've all seen the secret photos of convicted insurance fraudsters in the national papers)
If I am totaly honest (and I mean no disrespect), I don't beleive that your Dad drives the car more than you, I think that is a little white lie on your part there.
I've seen the lovely Merc in the drive in all your pictures with I'm guessing your Dad's initials on the plate. I've seen the modifications going on the car, seen the private plate in your name, seen the huge stereo, seen the huge wheels, heard about the bodykit you are having fitted. Your Dad must be Superdad to allow you to moddify his daily driver in your own personal way considering he drives it more than you..... Sorry mate, I just don't buy it at all.

And if I don't buy it you can be damed sure your insurance company wont.... Especially if your driving when a claim needs to be made.
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post #12 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 11:31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CivPilot View Post
Absolutely. The named driver route is a complete waste of time if you wish to build no claims. The simple fact is you are not building any no claims right now and the first time you "go it alone" on insurance they will treat you as a first timer and premiums will reflect this, no matter how old you are at the time. They really won't car how many years you have been a "named driver" on someone elses policy.

Direct line do allow named drivers to build up there no claims bonus.
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post #13 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 11:41
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I think a couple of insurance companies are doing that now. Would any other insurance company accept this though, or is it a way to secure your business in the future, to build up an NCB that is only useful with the company it was collected with.
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post #14 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 11:44
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It depends really. Elephant do 10 month Bonus Accelerator policies. These are accepted by other insurers no problem. I have heard stories of one or two people getting queried, but I know for a fact it's generally okay.

Direct Lines NCB for named drivers - I'm guessing that's transferable too in some circumstances.

The whole insurance system is a bit weird IMO. Wants replacing with something more sensible.
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post #15 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 11:45
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There are lots of articles on "fronting" to be found - but essentially it leads to invalid insurance and all the problems that go with it. Most insurers define named drivers as "occasional users of the vehicle".

http://www.swiftcover.com/EN/Home/ca...ungdrivers.pdf
http://uk.cars.yahoo.com/18082006/62...es-told-0.html
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post #16 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 11:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richierich View Post
I think a couple of insurance companies are doing that now. Would any other insurance company accept this though, or is it a way to secure your business in the future, to build up an NCB that is only useful with the company it was collected with.
Im not sure if you can take your ncb that way to another insurance company or not. Ive never gone down the named driver road and always had my own insurance. Even if it did cost alot at first you have to get through it to enable you to get the better cars. Im my opinion thats just part of life.

I find direct line expensive for there insurance so thats probably where there getting there money back anyway
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post #17 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 12:39
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I'm annoyed that I had to change my car after 6 months; so although didn't claim I lost my 6 months NCB I'd built up.
I also turn 25, 8 months in to my insurance; so have to pay the "under 24" rate for 4 months or loose my NCB again.
Can't wait for my next insurance though; 25 and 1yr NCB; it should rocket down.
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post #18 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 13:00
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If you change car on policy, surely your policy still runs to original term?
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post #19 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 13:24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by basegreen View Post
If you change car on policy, surely your policy still runs to original term?
Ah; actually I should have explained this too; my current insurer wouldn't insure me on the Civic!
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post #20 of 57 (permalink) Old 24th October 2006, 22:39
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One other point that I don't think has been mentioned on this thread is that if there is any HP involved with the purchase of a car the HP company insists (in the small print if anyone reads it), that the car must be comprehensively insured.
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