2006+ Honda Civic Forum banner

Keep current map or move Group N?

5K views 52 replies 8 participants last post by  michaelmarcellus77 
#1 ·
Hi all,

Currently, my FN2 is mapped (Flashpro) with the following bolt-ons:

Teg 421
Custom 2.5 with 200 cel (looking for something quieter if any of you have a spare Toda)
CPL CAI

I'm booked in at Grinspeed for:

Balancer shaft delete
FD2 Cams

I'll obviously be taking it easy until I can get it remapped afterwards and am debating whether to change the TB and intake (again if anyone has a spare RRC and FD2 TB, do shout) before I do. The flipside to the TB / Intake is I may charge it instead.

Reckon I'll be safe with my current map (if I don't drive like an idjit) or drop to the Group N again? I start a new job the day after I get the car back from Honda so I'll literally have no time to get it done and it's my daily.

I'll obviously discuss with Stevie but interested to hear your thoughts - there will be a delay of at least a week after the work is done as Honda will have the car, but that's another story.

Cheers!
 
See less See more
#2 ·
The oil pump doesn't need any changes to the current map but with cams it will.

Suspect you will be driving safe and slow until you get the map tweaked so assume it will be fine. You can always datalog and just check your AFR is on the rich side rather than lean and check for any knocks to put your mind at rest.

Stock and Group N are very rich as I found out a couple of weeks back.

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
 
#5 ·
Given that I quit my last place as I had three months notice and landed soundly on my behind and couldn't find anything for a while as I was overconfident - you're not wrong! As it is I'm changing industry, trying something new and keeping my bits crossed it works out.

Cheers for the advice guys. Given what gains @Bones126 has had with his SC I'm even in two minds about the cams now, the Delete is a definite as I also want the chain / tensioner changed etc for peace of mind for the future and I trust the guys at Grinspeed to spot anything untoward going on whilst they're fettling.

I'd have looked around to having it mapped the next day - but I have to get it to Honda for the roof to be resprayed and that's been a) a pita to actually get and b) a pita to actually arrange for them to do it!
 
#6 ·
You going for the drop in sump baffle too?

I was out on track this week at Curborough with heavy cornering and it really puts your mind at rest knowing its in there. There was a guy there with his EP3 and he was saying he had the oil starvation issue a while back which meant a full rebuild (didnt have a baffled sump at the time).
 
#8 ·
Depends re timing chain, I think my FN2 has had an easy life and has only done 30k ... when they checked it, it was in perfect condition with zero stretch so advised no chain/tensioner required.

But you are right, worth checking whats involved with labour as some jobs can be done cheap\for free at the same time (i.e the sump baffle).
 
  • Like
Reactions: stimcity
#9 ·
I know it’s all down to personal opinion, for me, if you are looking for a big gain, say over an additional 50bhp. I would look at the boosted route rather than spend on cams, followers, oil pump, manifolds bigger TB etc. as that will mount up to what you could get a boosted kit for, especially second hand. Unless you want to stay NA, which isn’t an issue for me but others do like to keep NA. If you looking for anything around 250 NA then cams I would do yes. Like I say, if you looking for big power then SC or if just more power than standard the NA.
 
  • Like
Reactions: stimcity
#13 ·
This is it, the Manifold (thanks again ;)), exhaust and intake; plus map made a huge difference, light and day. The Meisters did the same for the handling. Somewhere on here is a graph from back in the day from TDi comparing FN2s to FD2s - I found it the other day, yes there's a difference, yes they're more aggressive, but I don't know if it's really worth £600ish on top of the delete and chain etc for what at the end of the day is marginal - I appreciate for £400 more you can get TDi's or Drag Cartels etc but if I do that I figure you may as well uprate the tensioners etc and go full-on. Likewise, with the TB and intake, I've got a Grams 72mm sitting here waiting to have something done with it, but again, if I just put it all towards a charger later in the day it's certainly more cost-effective.

I haven't done anything to the car to chase figures, in fact, I can only guestimate what she's making right now, however, she drives absolutely superbly and easily out handles say an S3, not as quick mind.

I was absolutely set on getting them, but I'm having buyers remorse in advance, plus there's a chance I can buy a place locally and that has to come into it too!
 
#17 ·
Hey guys, just was reading the thread, just quick question for u guys, been out of here for a bit, since Chris did my map 4 me, have RRC 2.5 catback, skunk2 CAI and skunk2 DIC
I'm thinking of putting in a turbo or SC, Im first going to get TB and 3inch,but then want to get it boosted as I'm not that happy with results... Any advice would b great
Thanks
Michael

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
 
#18 ·
If you're not happy with the results, is it worth continuing the expensive NA route with a TB and exhaust, followed by another etune? At best, doing this will get you a few BHP up top and a little midrange and I'd guess it'd be unlikely to dispel your lingering sense of disappointment with what you have.

If you're considering going FI, then all your nice NA parts (RRC mani, TB, Skunk2 CAI and cams) kind of become superfluous. May as well strip them all off and go back to stock parts before sticking the turbo / sc on. Then you can sell them and offset the cost of the new parts.

Or unless you really love the FN2, sell it and start with something faster...
 
#19 ·
Ok, yeah, I hear what ** saying, when I first bought it, I fell in love with it off the bat, then I started with the upgrades, and I'm not sure if I haven't quite got the right combination or what, but I put the rrc, cams and CAI in at once, with map, and was just expecting a little more. I still love everything about the car, the way it handles, the feel, everything, just really want to b able to pull up with an s3 or even wrx and KNOW that they're getting smoked! I wasn't aware that if I go FI I have to take off the bolt ons.... Thanks for your advice, definitely something to think about

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
 
#21 ·
I wouldn't bother with FD2 cams, go for the Tried and tested TDI cams or try the skunk2 DIC's

I'd get the cams fd2 oil pump and chain and tensioner done at the same time with the clockwise baffle.

My next step is the gearbox, so going to be changing the FD and possibly 3-4-5with longer 6th for acceleration.

it has to be the best way to get an increase in acceleration for our cars ££ wise.
 
#22 ·
Thanks alot for your replies, it's exactly what I was after... Do you think I should do TB, oil pump etc, or just go strait to that set up? I'm pretty sure that those other bolt ons may not give what I'm after, but it could also b a combination of not the right parts, map etc.... I'm not sure, but I'm getting some money in the next month or so, and just really am not sure which route to go down.
Thanks again to my [emoji108][emoji106]

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
 
#24 ·
Yeah, I'm not really looking for track car, just something that is fun, with the bolt ons I have I thought I'd at least be struggling for traction at times, but no... So I just want to get to enough power for that at least, it's kind of hard to explain what it is I'm after.... I read alot before buying the parts I did, and people described struggling to get the power down of the start, but I haven't had that prob. Chris from civic rsa did my map, so it's surely not that, I'm not quite sure what it is. **** I need to get the exhaust and TB done and then c after that.
If SC is such high maintenance, it is my daily, so prob won't mess with that, if I can't get it right, I unfortunately may have to sell it and get something else... Don't know
Thanks

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
 
#25 ·
I’ve got 250hp and going to play with final drives and then stop as it’s enough to get into trouble with. And is reliable enough for track days if I choose to.

I’ve looked at selling. But there isn’t really anything else out there that is interesting. Everything is turbo now and 300bhp+ is easily achievable.

Saying that I’m considering an Alfa Romeo 4c and i30 N at the moment. But wouldn’t be home enough to drive and enjoy them hence sticking with the civic


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
#26 ·
Sounds to me like you've got totally the wrong car. I love my 250BHP NA FN2 and it goes great, particularly on track. But it isn't a car to win the traffic lights Grand Prix if that's what you're into. FI could be the answer but I've seen scores of supercharged civics broken at Grinspeed and Cadwell Park. As the poster above says, you have to really maintain them or they will go bang.
 
#30 ·
If your power hungry street racing...

Turbo
Or supercharger but remember superchargers need a lot of care and attention.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I have to agree with this, if you go down the supercharger route (which is great) and you are not carefully with it they are prone to breaking. By being careful I mean, do not be tempted to change the pulley size for more loads more boost and over spin the charger which could lead to a snapped shaft (plenty have done it with no problems though) and if you do go the route get someone to map it like Chris at EFI who will set you a soft rev limiter so as to help prevent snapping the shaft with the power bouncing backwards a forward at high revs as it hits the limiter and it cuts in and then recovers at full power causing a quick stop start motion that helps towards snapping the shaft. They can be reliable though, if you care for it and drive reasonably sensible, Mmmmmmm >:)
 
#28 ·
The dyno graph I got was from the tuner that installed the parts, but I don't think he really knew what he was doing as Chris and a few others looked at the map and said it was way off. And Chris's map feels alot nicer. But with the map from the tuner, it come out at 140wkw?is that bout right or should I be getting a bit more? I think with the new map it would b a bit higher, but not 100percent. Don't get me wrong, I love the car, or I wouldn't have started modding, but the amount spent, **** was just expecting more after reading reviews, which makes me think I am missing something, some part or parts.
My graph


Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
 
#37 ·
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top