Admission for my FN2 which one? - Civinfo
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post #1 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 20:25 Thread Starter
 
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Admission for my FN2 which one?

MUGEN AIRBOX VS GRUPPEM

which should I choose, which will provide more gains.

Regards
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post #2 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 20:46
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Originally Posted by hondafn2 View Post
MUGEN AIRBOX VS GRUPPEM

which should I choose, which will provide more gains.

Regards
They are both very good.

I think its a preferece thing between these two as power wise there should not be more than a couple of HP diference.
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post #3 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 20:55
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Can I ask why not the likes of Tegiwa etc
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post #4 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 22:05
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Hks rsk !
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post #5 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 22:32
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If I could afford it I would go mugen, gruppe m, tegiwa in that order for closed box or cpl cai or skunk2 cai for better gains
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post #6 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 22:53
 
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i went the fn2 gruppe m route via tdi north.. the induction kit gave me 3BHP with flashpro it gave me a whole 10 BHP don't bother..
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post #7 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 22:58
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What do you expect on an NA motor producing 100BHP/Litre from the factory?


Unfortunately with any Petrol NA engine you have to get oily to make power
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post #8 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 23:14
 
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fair play.. i bought the gruppe m off pauls development car at tdi and we had a play around with it and then added flashpro and spent the best part of the day tuning it.. the end product was i spent nearly 1000.00 on gruppe m and flashpro and gained 10 bhp..enough said
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post #9 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 23:19
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Unfortunately stock cams and manifold control the cars breathing and very little will help without removing these parts, many parts work in conjunction with others
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post #10 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 23:33
 
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Unfortunately stock cams and manifold control the cars breathing and very little will help without removing these parts, many parts work in conjunction with others
agreed..just trying to say that you will not get any substansial gains from an induction kit on it's own..
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post #11 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 23:34
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fair play.. i bought the gruppe m off pauls development car at tdi and we had a play around with it and then added flashpro and spent the best part of the day tuning it.. the end product was i spent nearly 1000.00 on gruppe m and flashpro and gained 10 bhp..enough said
I got a 10 bhp increase just by cleaning my EGR valve and using Shell v-Power diesel. Cost me 13 for the gaskets, and an hour of my time !

The next 200 I spent was on a Celtic Stage 2 remap, which took me from 149 bhp to 206 bhp, and a very respectable 336 lbs/ft of torque !

[IMG][/IMG]

Diesels are just slow, noisy, dirty tractors...NOT !
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post #12 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 23:37
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But a type R will still out run you, sound better and give a more rewarding drive all on the standard clutch .


This is a NA tuning thread, in the Type R section, take that torque spike and rapidly diminishing BHP curve to the diesel section
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post #13 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 23:37
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Hks rsk !
lol


Back on topic.

I think Paul @ TDi-North did a back to back with GruppeM and Mugen. Think Mugen had the edge for 2hp or something like that.
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post #14 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 23:39
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But a type R will still out run you, sound better and give a more rewarding drive all on the standard clutch .


This is a NA tuning thread, in the Type R section, take that torque spike and rapidly diminishing BHP curve to the diesel section
Ha ha , made me giggle.... Doenst even make enough rmps for VTEC to kick in.....

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post #15 of 47 (permalink) Old 30th March 2013, 23:42
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post #16 of 47 (permalink) Old 31st March 2013, 00:00
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But a type R will still out run you, sound better and give a more rewarding drive all on the standard clutch .


This is a NA tuning thread, in the Type R section, take that torque spike and rapidly diminishing BHP curve to the diesel section
Ouch ! Touched a nerve, I think ! Apologies for posting in the wrong thread, just making a point. If there was a diesel section, which we derv heads have asked for time and time again, I would mate. Don't be so dismissive of those curves. Yeah, my engine dies @ 5K, but starts pulling from 1,800, way before your v-Tec has had it's breakfast. I can keep up with 220 bhp CTR's. Hagan and Dezi would slaughter me, though.

I'm @ Cadwell next month. Ask Staffs Deltic for a modded CTR's perspective on my tractor.

Again, apologies for posting in the wrong thread. Will pay more attention next time.
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post #17 of 47 (permalink) Old 31st March 2013, 00:02
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Ouch ! Touched a nerve, I think ! Apologies for posting in the wrong thread, just making a point. If there was a diesel section, which we derv heads have asked for time and time again, I would mate. Don't be so dismissive of those curves. Yeah, my engine dies @ 5K, but starts pulling from 1,800, way before your v-Tec has had it's breakfast. I can keep up with 220 bhp CTR's. Hagan and Dezi would slaughter me, though.

I'm @ Cadwell next month. Ask Staffs Deltic for a modded CTR's perspective on my tractor.

Again, apologies for posting in the wrong thread. Will pay more attention next time.

Keep up with 220bhp CTR all the way up to 270km/h?

Just messing with you mate!
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post #18 of 47 (permalink) Old 31st March 2013, 00:04
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I have no worries with dervs, I have run a few in the past with more than 230 bhp and 330+ ft ( VAG PDs)

But I know what a good K20 can do

Anyone that lets a car get below 1800 when ragging cant drive, even on a good launch i set revs to 4k lol
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post #19 of 47 (permalink) Old 31st March 2013, 00:07
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Ian, is the 10bhp the full story though? Have you done an overlay to see the full picture? Heres an overlay i did myself from my last dyno where i made 2bhp. If you look at the curve you can see why the car is a lot faster despite the lack of peak gain.

uploadfromtaptalk1364684860258.jpg

Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 2
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post #20 of 47 (permalink) Old 31st March 2013, 00:10
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Back on topic


Think of an NA engine like an air pump. adding fuel is easy - you just increase duty cycle and injector size as required, the fuel system is pressurised electrically by a pump so remove this line of thought.

What you need to do is increase the amount of air flowing through the engine. Power= fuel+air+spark. To this you need to increase the valve open period and or the draw of the piston stroke ( compression).

Now all things being equal when you change throttle bodys, manifolds, intakes etc all you are doing is making a less retrictive path for the air to flow along but the main restriction behind all this is piston bore size and compression.

The person above got 10BHP from a GruppeM and tune. A set of cams might give him 10BHP now as well, where as on the stock airbox he might only have got 5bhp.

At bolt on levels you are only removing restrictions but together they add up and even small gains on these engines are very noticable. Tuning is a must though to extract full potential



To reiterate Lee's post above

Its not the numbers on the graph, its the shape and the area under it
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