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Discussion Starter #1
Hey guys, and gals. I haven't posted on here in a while, but I wanted to share my latest mod with you, because I'm sure it could be done with your cars as well.

For quite some time, myself and some other members of 8thcivic.com have been discussing using cowl induction on our Si's to get much colder air into the intake. Each of us that has done a custom setup has gone a slightly different route, but we've all come to the conclussion that this is the best mod you can do next to a race header.

Before this intake, I was using a Fujita SRI, which we all know suffer greatly from heat soak. Using a Scangauge II to monitor intake air temps, average IAT with the SRI at highway speeds were anywhere from 15 to 25 degrees over ambient air temps. With the custom cowl setup, IAT at highway speed are anywhere from 1 to 8 degrees above ambient air temps. Of course, these temps spike up dramatically when stopped at a light, because cowl induction need the car to move to generate the colder outside air.

Here are a few pics of the setup that I'm using:

In this pic, you can see I'm using gold foil heat wrap (not cheap by the way, but you can completely cover the airbox with about $70 worth)


You can also see that I have the lower air hole capped off. Currently, I'm only taking air through the cowl, but will probably use the lower air port a little further down the line.


Here you can see the the hole that was cut into the metal shelf to get the cold air from the cowl area



This project has been a very slow work in progress, and I'm still not done. I'm currently trying to sculpt a shape out of styrofoam that I can make a fiberglass scoop out of that would come through the cowl, and face the windshield.

I've driven a few different 8th Gen Si's, all using different intakes, and I would be willing to bet cold hard cash that this style intake is better than any production model, including the Gruppe M which uses a similar principle.

Here is the original thread that started it all at 8thCivic.com. It's very, long, but very informative, and worth the read. If you don't have ADD, and can make it through the entire thread, it would be well worth the read.

Cowl induction for cold, ram air for the Si? - 8th Generation Honda Civic Forum

Here is the completed intake thread, from the OP (NitrousG35), of the previous thread. I give many, many props to Nitrous/Bill for starting this discussion on the 8th, and opening my eyes to a better intake alternative, than just using a "filter on a stick". This thread is actually much shorther than the original thread, so if you DO have ADD, and just want the Cliff Notes, click on this thread.[smilie=tongue.gif]

Cowl Induction is done, finished, finis, Woot Woot! - 8th Generation Honda Civic Forum


I know there are a number of things that I've left out with this intro to cowl induction, but please feel free to throw out any questions, comments, and complaints you may have. The only thing I'm trying to do is share the knowledge I gained, and give you guys a better intake option than a "filter on a stick"
 

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Discussion Starter #2
Damn. 43 views, and not one reply? Lame.
 

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mattsbobo
I know this topic and what you made very well from 8th civic forum. Im a member of this forum. I know all the story what made Nitrous on his SI. I'll tell you more. I bought from Xfactor WRX his X intake but never arive. I made DIY x intake with big help from soxfan. He made for me MAF housing. This intake doesn't work with stoc ECU. Now i have this intake again on board but with hondata. Next week i'm going on dyno.
 

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With this custom cowl, I wonder what effect ducting neat oxygen (the bottle stuff) into the cowl would have?

Tom
 

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Discussion Starter #5
mattsbobo
I know this topic and what you made very well from 8th civic forum. Im a member of this forum. I know all the story what made Nitrous on his SI. I'll tell you more. I bought from Xfactor WRX his X intake but never arive. I made DIY x intake with big help from soxfan. He made for me MAF housing. This intake doesn't work with stoc ECU. Now i have this intake again on board but with hondata. Next week i'm going on dyno.
NitrousG35, and Soxfan are both extremely good guys. I'm so sorry you were one of the many that got burned bi XfactorX. If it makes you feel any better (and I'm sure it won't) X is in jail right now.

Why wouldn't your intake work with the stock ECU? Are you using the X-style intake, or a cowl induction deal like me, and Nitrous?
 

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Damn. 43 views, and not one reply? Lame.
Hi Matt. One thing you'll need to bear in mind is that Civics hold a slightly different status in other countries other than the US and modifying them to the extent you have is not quite as popular. I know this through steadily modifying my '89 CRX. For example, despite Hondas being one of the best and easiest cars to modify well, the access to decent perfomance/aftermarket parts and modifying information here is poor.
Anyway, please don't feel disheartened by a lack of comments here as I can assure you that there will be a few keen members who will read and take notice of your work - they just might not know what to say.

Keep up the good work! :cool:
 

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I'm so sorry you were one of the many that got burned bi XfactorX. If it makes you feel any better (and I'm sure it won't) X is in jail right now.
I know that because i'm every day on this forum:)

Why wouldn't your intake work with the stock ECU? Are you using the X-style intake, or a cowl induction deal like me, and Nitrous?
We have in FN2 better stock intake vs USDM SI. Intake pipe is a lot longer (from TB--->air box), intake resonator also. On hondata web page i found info that Euro Civic has a different MAF calibration. The whole hope is in this that HONDATA ecu is designed for different than the factory intake. Look this is my dyno with X intake SRI and P2R spacer and stoc ECU

RED is stock intake
BLUE is X intake
Now i have hondata and test again X intake but with FN2 stoc intake pipe. I replaced this CRV tube. I made a heatsheald and plug fresh air from under the plastic plate of the engine. I using bottom of stock air box

it was

it is now


this my duct for fresh air


tak wyglada dolot teraz z osłoną





** sorry for mega OT:oops: This your topic
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Hi Matt. One thing you'll need to bear in mind is that Civics hold a slightly different status in other countries other than the US and modifying them to the extent you have is not quite as popular. I know this through steadily modifying my '89 CRX. For example, despite Hondas being one of the best and easiest cars to modify well, the access to decent perfomance/aftermarket parts and modifying information here is poor.
Anyway, please don't feel disheartened by a lack of comments here as I can assure you that there will be a few keen members who will read and take notice of your work - they just might not know what to say.

Keep up the good work! :cool:
Thanks for the heads up Ben. I had realized that your aftermarket was completely different than ours, but I had no idea that it wasn't as well supported.

MW1978: So Hondata doesn't recomend at least intake, or header for their Euro reflash? THey do for ours, but I understand you siad that you have better intake piping than us. Also, was X selling intakes here on Civinfo, or did you find out about it from 8th Civic?
 

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I bought this intake twice. First from Emmanuel second time from Soxfan (CRV tube and MAF housing from soxfan). Apexi filter is from Corsport.

hondata reflash for SI need minimum intake or header.
hondata reflash for Euro CTR is configured to work with stock intake or with any combination of intake header or exhaust.
Any intake SRI or CAI doesn't works with the stock ECU
this is the man quotation which all knows about euro CTR

Hey guys, this is a copy and paste from another post I made last week.. but it explains why there are no manufacture’s really developing intakes for the FN2… have a read..

Even if manufactures develop a intake the intake could ONLY flow exactly the same amount of air as the stock intake, Quick summary - For a intake to be successful on a FN2 you need a intake + a ECU tuned for the intake.

The long version….

This does goes against the common line of modifying a Naturally Aspired Honda Engine as typically the first modification you do to a Honda Engine is an intake modification, allowing the engine to breath more efficiently… with the FN2 K20 Engine this is not the case… if you wish to lean more.. please keep reading.

The reason we are not releasing an intake alone is because for the first time on the k20 Engine Honda have included a MAF sensor (Mass Air Flow Sensor) this sensor is directly responsible for amount of fuel the engine consumes and directly effects engine performance. The MAF sensor is VERY sensitive replacing the standard intake to allow more air to flow past the MAF sensor will cause the car to go dangerously lean, if you decrease the intake internal diameter you will cause the car to go extremely rich.

If a intake is designed with the same internal flow as the standard intake a normal fuel mixture can be achieved although with our internal test unless you increase the physical amount of air which enters the engine there is no net performance benefit.

During our testing we developed prototype intakes with the same flow as the standard intake making the intake compatibility with the standard MAF sensor and standard ECU whilst there was a gain in induction noise there was a decrease in every example of power and torque. In fact even disconnecting the second half of the standard induction system will loose power…. Honda have truly fine tuned the standard intake to be the very best it can be when used in conjunction with the MAF sensor and standard ECU.

Ok now to the positive side of the story, Yes we have developed a JTune forced fed cold air induction system included in our Extreme. Our intake is 3” in diameter throughout the entire length of the intake with an extreme K&N filter placed in the bottom bumper bar, this provides maximum amounts of cold air which is forced fed via acceleration forces into the engine.

The reason we have an intake in our Extreme kit is because the Extreme kit includes our ECU which has been tuned perfectly to work with our intake. The combination of our intake + ECU allows us to harness the maximum amounts of cold air into the engine combined with correct ECU tuning to making everything work in harmony.

Please note our Mild flash ECU is only compatible with the standard Honda Intake, to use our intake you must have an Extreme or better JTune performance kit.




Hope this helps clear up the reasons why we are not releasing our intake alone as a separate upgrade.

If you want to hear vtec engaging you can remove the 2nd intake chamber which connects to the bottom of the standard intake box. Doing so gives great induction noises where you can really hear the engine breathing, sadly doing so results in a 3kw loss of power almost everywhere across the rev range.

the whole hope is in the hondata reflash. If my intake still not works I will change it for gruppeM
 

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Discussion Starter #10
^^^Wow, that's pretty crazy. Is that from Hondata's website, or K&N? That clearly doesn't apply to the Si though. So far, I'm really impressed with how Nitrous's intake is working out. Mine is a little different than his, and I still haven't completed it, but so far the difference between the stock intake, a Fujita SRI, and the cowl induction modified stock intake, is quite apparent.
 

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^^^Wow, that's pretty crazy. Is that from Hondata's website, or K&N? That clearly doesn't apply to the Si though. So far, I'm really impressed with how Nitrous's intake is working out. Mine is a little different than his, and I still haven't completed it, but so far the difference between the stock intake, a Fujita SRI, and the cowl induction modified stock intake, is quite apparent.
I have this info from Australian Honda tuner JTUNE. He's also a dealer of hondata.
I like this idea of cowl indaction but i'm afraid wather. Do you have new MAF housing designed for this intake from Mike??
I'm thinking to buy from gruppeM only this under bonet carbon part and make DIY intake box with modif. MAF and apexi filter. Whole intake cost to mutch for me.
 

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No, I don't have Soxfan's modified MAF. I'm just using the stock one. Nitrous said Soxfan's is a lot better than the stock one, but I don't have the cash for it.

As far as water goes, it hasn't been a problem at all. When parked, the filter has gotten wet, but while driving, it's no problem at all. Like I said earlier, I'm currently making a scoop for it, that will end all water problems.
 

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Just as an update MW, water hasn't been an issue at all with this setup.
 

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Just as an update MW, water hasn't been an issue at all with this setup.
HI
I threw out this custom intake to the basket. this intake does not work again. I miss this sound but the car is evidently stronger with stock intake.
I don't even believe in gruppeM any more:(
 
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