[NORTHCROFT]

Having had a Civic Type S gt 2.2 cdti for 2½ years now with no idea how old the pads were, I got a free brake test done and everything is fine, plenty wear on pads, I am very light on the brakes !opcorn:

It made me just check the web to see diesel driving styles v petrol, think I pretty much worked it all out myself, this Civic being my first diesel. However, I judge junctions well and slow down by gears, so these conflicting answers interested me as they are almost totally opposite, which is correct then ha ha :worms:


10+1 Tips to Driving a Diesel Car Economically - The Green Optimistic

9)THE GREEN OPTIMISTIC SITE SAYS :- Do not use your engine brake to stop. Coast to a stop either in neutral or by holding the clutch down. Using engine brake (gearing down) wastes a lot of fuel. It’s true that this is a harder job for your brake pads, the difference is insignificant, and your clutch will not wear out as quickly. Brakes cost less than clutches do, and when combined with the gas you are saving, it’s a far better choice.


How to Drive a Turbo Diesel Car with Manual Transmission Efficiently

14)WIKIHOW SAYS :- Engine braking (gear down) to slow or stop, in modern diesel engines uses less fuel than just braking, or coasting to a stop either in neutral or by holding the clutch down. This is because modern diesels have direct injection which is computer controlled. At idle, the injectors are delivering a very small amount if fuel. When you use the engine to slow the vehicle at speed (throttle closed), the injectors shut off. While the engine braking (gearing down) method of stopping is easier on your brakes, it is harder on the clutch. Brakes cost less than clutches do, so it depends on the situation for what the better choice is.


Confusing ?

 

[JackW]

I have the diesel and I use both to be honest.. When im approaching lights and I know they are about to change to green I'll slow down with gears rather than foot break.

But if I know that im going to need to come to a complete stop then I will use the foot break then apply the handbreak. I've heard its bad for your clutch to keep your oot on it and leave it in gear when you're just sat doing absolutely nothing...

 

[NORTHCROFT]

I have the diesel and I use both to be honest.. When im approaching lights and I know they are about to change to green I'll slow down with gears rather than foot break.

But if I know that im going to need to come to a complete stop then I will use the foot break then apply the handbreak. I've heard its bad for your clutch to keep your oot on it and leave it in gear when you're just sat doing absolutely nothing...

yeah thats fair enough, I cant understand why one suggests using gears to change down IS BAD, the other says ITS GOOD. . . . couldnt be much different !

 

[Ry_B]

Engine braking will add extra wear to the flywheel which is already a weak spot

 

[Sprotty]

Lifting off the power and coming to a stop in gear is best for fuel consumption, wear on flywheel will only increase if you downshift forcing the revs to rise. Depressing the clutch the engine still uses fuel to maintain idle.


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[purekillforce]

I never use changing down a gear to brake. Wasn't that only ever a thing for when drums were the peak of braking technology?

if i know i'm going to have to slow down or stop, i'll just cruise with the clutch down and gently apply the brake as needed. I'd rather wear down the pads than any component of the engine to slow down!

 

[Sprotty]

Just lifting off is no different to maintaining forward speed in terms of wear. Coasting with the clutch depressed your not fully in control of the car.


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[Farqui]

"On newer cars if the car is in gear and your foot is off the accelerator, the injectors shut off completely, creating essentially "free" mileage — your car's going but you're not using gas beyond a small amount for*engine braking, or the engine's resistance to your costing.

Don't coast by disengaging the clutch and/or putting the car in neutral. This will cause the engine to go into idle which uses up gas more gas than simply leaving the car in gear and letting it coast along with minimal engine input.[1]"

http://m.wikihow.com/Hypermile#_refanchor-1

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[purekillforce]

Coasting with the clutch depressed, you're not fully in control of the car.

Only with regards to acceleration. If you know you need to slow down, all you need to be in control of is deceleration. which you are by having a foot over the brake.

 

[Sprotty]

Straight out of the Highway Code. Engine idle may also not produce enough vaccum for extended periods of braking.


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[purekillforce]

Straight out of the Highway Code. Engine idle may also not produce enough vaccum for extended periods of braking.


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Well, if i'm using the engine to brake at all, it's more of a minor adjustment in speed than actual braking, so by depressing the clutch i'm not losing the ability to "engine brake". EDIT: I'll certainly never change down a gear in order to slow myself down, only to better match the speed i've changed to.

I'm also quite aware of gravity, so i'm not about to let the car spiral into an 80mph free fall into traffic. It's easy to just apply more pressure on the brake.

Increased use, i.e. brake fade. As long as i'm not stopping from 100mph, the brakes should perform as well as ever, regardless of if i'm braking with the clutch depressed.

Steering response? not sure how depressing the clutch affects steering response, to be honest. I've never noticed it, but when i am braking, it's usually in a straight line.

More difficult to change gears?? Not that i've noticed. I know where the gears are, and it's easy to check your speed and select an apporpriate gear if you need to do so.

Yes, those points are from the highway code, but it seems to be quite outdated with a lot of the information contained in it.

I'm happy to discuss it further, but the reasons for not having the clutch depressed when braking (not talking about maintaining a constant speed, you should have the clutch engaged then) doesn't seem to interfere with braking efficiency. Maybe it wears your brakes out quicker, but it'll be a small amount, and brakes are there for that very purpose.

 

[law000]

I think you find that slowing down while in gear uses less fuel then idle - diesels maintain revs by controlling injection of fuel (unlike petrol). Idle requires more fuel then slowing down.
Coasting means your vehicle is travelling unaided by the engine and in general practice is ill-advised.
If you need to stop, use brakes. If you are just slowing then leave the car in gear with clutch out and only change down when appropriate (it to maintain revs above idle or to start accelerating)

 

[wardy2602]

In modern day driving tests they teach you to coast and brake as mentioned in this thread already this is not best for fuel consumption but better for wear on engine components.
I got told off by my old man when I drove his car after been put on his insurance when I did it, his words were "your not in control of the car son, you shouldnt drive like that" but that was how i was tought i said to which he replied "well thats just wrong you should always be in gear so that you are in control of the car at all times".
To this i conclude
Yes rolling and coasting uses more fuel but wears the engine less.
Using your gears to brake will cause more wear on engine components but is better for fuel efficiency.
there are many drivers which will sit in either of these camps and there are + and - points for both

But I say this when driving in adverse weather conditions the last thing you want to do is brake traction so after passing my test twenty years ago and having plenty of experience myself now I sit with my old man and use my gears every time and touch wood I aint broke owt yet cause of it.
Wardy

 

[Sprotty]

Not sure when reducing engine wear by tiny amounts became more important than safety! What the hell are they teaching nowadays!


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[law000]

Also AFAIK, leaving in gear while braking reduces the chance of locking your wheels as the drive train keeps then rotating

 

[purekillforce]

I think you find that slowing down while in gear uses less fuel then idle - diesels maintain revs by controlling injection of fuel (unlike petrol). Idle requires more fuel then slowing down.
Coasting means your vehicle is travelling unaided by the engine and in general practice is ill-advised.
If you need to stop, use brakes. If you are just slowing then leave the car in gear with clutch out and only change down when appropriate (it to maintain revs above idle or to start accelerating)

Agreed, coasting while driving is a bad habit, but coasting while applying the brake to come to a stop, or even as you approach a queue moving slowly, i feel, is fine.

You aren't losing control of the car, as all the control required is in how much pressure you put on the brake pedal and your steering.

My grandad tought me to drive, and he used to use the engine to brake all the time. Coming on to a slip road? Drop it down a gear and hear the engine come down from the redline. it was the only time his car ever saw revs that high!

I guess it is a matter of preference, and which components you want to put the strain on, but i don't find that i have less control with the clutch depressed, except for a lack of acceleration (which isn't something i'm worried about, as i'm doing it with the intention of slowing down).

 

[Farqui]

I think you're missing the point of down shifting, you match engine revs to road speed sufficient to limit any stress on the drive train or engine. Rather than just slam it down as gear ASAP!

 

[purekillforce]

I think you're missing the point of down shifting, you match engine revs to road speed sufficient to limit any stress on the drive train or engine. Rather than just slam it down as gear ASAP!

isn't that what engine braking entails? Changing down a gear to let the engine slow the car with your foot off the throttle?

 

[law000]

I think you're missing the point of down shifting, you match engine revs to road speed sufficient to limit any stress on the drive train or engine. Rather than just slam it down as gear ASAP!

This

Surely gentle deceleration forces are weak compared to high boost turbocharged forces generated during acceleration

 

[law000]

Only one way to solve this: