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2007, FK1, 1.4 DSI, Manual
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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
might sound daft but remove the fuel filler cap and try again just incase its airlocked somehow
sounds like your pump is triggering might just need primed if it ran dry while changing
does the car sound like its trying to start or just turns over
The car sounds like it's trying to start. I'll try the fuel filler cap tomorrow, thanks 馃榿
 

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2007, FK1, 1.4 DSI, Manual
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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Sorry for the massive delay, had a busy few days but a lot has happened.

Getting the car started:
After removing the quick connector on the fuel line in the engine bay, no fuel was coming through, despite fuel coming out of the pump. I attached a piece of transparent hose to the fuel outlet on the pump to see if there were any issues. Lo and behold, there wasn't enough fuel pressure to get it through the hose. I knew this was an issue with o-ring placement on the pump, but I just couldn't get it tight. Eventually, I tried placing two o-rings in there (old and new), so the bottom one pushed the upper one into the socket. I could immediately tell it was in properly as it was difficult to remove again. The next day, I refitted the filter and it started first time 馃榿. I've attached a picture for clarity.
Gesture Finger Nail Thumb Wood


After fitting:
After driving around a bit today, I noticed the stuttering issue was annoyingly still present. After a while I got fed up, so when it started juddering, I just held the throttle at the point that was causing it. However, after holding it for ~ 5 seconds, an engine warning came on as well as a VSA 馃槵. Luckily, my mate was in the car with me, who has an OBD2 reader, so I carefully drove to his house to pick it up. The code
was as follows "P0339: Crankshaft Position sensor A circuit intermittent."
Watch Gesture Communication Device Finger Gadget

The VSA warning wasn't present after restarting the car, so I presume it was just because of the juddering.

We cleared the code and looked at the full system information. I noticed that the EGR Error percentage was at 99.2%, indicating that it's virtually dead. We took it for a spin while using the code reader to monitor the throttle position, engine load and fuel system.

When the stutter occurs, the engine load jumps to 100% regardless of what it was previously, with throttle position fluctuating slightly (although this may be the car juddering causing the throttle to physically push against my foot). The EGR error percentage remained at 99.2% for the whole time.

I also managed to keep the car stuttering for ~ 5 seconds and the engine warning light came on again. The same code (P0339) was present.

My hypothesis:
Based on the fact that the stutter only occurs when under load, I think that what happens is that due to the EGR valve not working correctly, when the ECU is attempting to fire it and hence expecting the extra gasses, when the gasses aren't present the engine spikes to 100% load to compensate, causing the judder. This would also line up with the fact that throttle response in the leadup to a judder feels extremely lacking.

I reckon the engine warning code is thrown up as due to the harsh juddering (feels almost like stalling a diesel, but for 5 seconds straight), there may be a loose connection on the sensor, momentarily causing a voltage fluctuation.

Moving forward:
My next move would be to purchase a new EGR valve, but seeing as it's 拢70 for a new one, I thought I'd consult you guys before doing it, as I don't want to mindlessly throw money at it, or ignore issues that may be more severe than I realise (i.e. the crankshaft sensor).

@peter_voly hopefully you find this useful, and if you've got any more questions feel free to shoot them my way, I'm happy to help 馃榿.
 

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Sorry for the massive delay, had a busy few days but a lot has happened.

Getting the car started:
After removing the quick connector on the fuel line in the engine bay, no fuel was coming through, despite fuel coming out of the pump. I attached a piece of transparent hose to the fuel outlet on the pump to see if there were any issues. Lo and behold, there wasn't enough fuel pressure to get it through the hose. I knew this was an issue with o-ring placement on the pump, but I just couldn't get it tight. Eventually, I tried placing two o-rings in there (old and new), so the bottom one pushed the upper one into the socket. I could immediately tell it was in properly as it was difficult to remove again. The next day, I refitted the filter and it started first time 馃榿. I've attached a picture for clarity.
View attachment 327607
that was my next suggestion.
pushing that pump into place against the new rings is tight, Honda say lube with clean engine oil, works a treat.
 

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Yeah bro nice info, I actually read somewhere that changing the gearbox fluid did some help too, and Im thinking of trying it since lately I noticed that the stuttering happens most of the times right after a gear change. Im not super knowledgable about cars, but since sometimes shifting to the 1st gear is pretty hard, I think it might be of use, just throwing these thoughts out there. Also curious about that egr valve change tho.. I read that in some cases that was the thing, also read something about oem coils.. Who knows man.
 

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2007, FK1, 1.4 DSI, Manual
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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
Yeah bro nice info, I actually read somewhere that changing the gearbox fluid did some help too, and Im thinking of trying it since lately I noticed that the stuttering happens most of the times right after a gear change. Im not super knowledgable about cars, but since sometimes shifting to the 1st gear is pretty hard, I think it might be of use, just throwing these thoughts out there. Also curious about that egr valve change tho.. I read that in some cases that was the thing, also read something about oem coils.. Who knows man.
The transmission fluid change does sound interesting, as do the coils. Only issue is I feel like this could quite easily become an infinite money pit, throwing things at it till it's fixed 馃槀. I'm probably going to order the EGR valve, I'll install it and see what the score is.
 

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Discussion Starter · #27 ·
@peter_voly Sorry for the time its taken for me to get back to you. I've installed the new EGR valve and it's not made a difference. Managed to work out that the juddering occurs ~2-3k rpm in any gear (other than 1st) when under load. This could be just going up a hill or when trying to floor it. Strangely enough, it only happens when it's warmed up. I could be driving about for 10-15 mins from a cold start and it'd be absolutely fine. Even an Italian tune up didn't work 馃槵.

Unfortunately it might be a while before I'm able to update you again as after driving around perfectly (except for the occasional stutter) all day Saturday, went to start it that evening, and it stalled while idling. Seems to do it whenever the accelerator is pressed, or alternator is engaged. The reason I'm mentioning this is because it also only seems to do this when it's warmed up, so after a cold start it'll happily sit for 2 or 3 mins before dying, so I'm not sure if this is a related issue.

Seeing as both issues seem to be an air/fuel issue, and only occurs when it's warmed up, I'm not sure if it's an issue with the pre-cat oxygen sensor, but at this point it's a problem the garage can sort out.

I've tried unplugging the MAF and throttle body position sensor and still no luck. My usual garage can't get me in till next Monday (19/12/22) so sucks to be me 馃槀.
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 ·
Sorry for going dark for the last 2-3 weeks, been busy with the usual Christmas chaos.

Got the car running again, but still no fix on the juddering. Garage told me that it sounds like and behaves like a throttle body issue, but he's unsure if it could also be an electrical fault, what with it being an electric throttle body.

Told me my best bet is take it to the local Honda garage and see if they can detect anything. Having my MOT done this Thursday, so I will likely book it in at the local Honda garage after that.

I'll keep you updated 馃槈
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 ·
Good news! Last night I decided to plug my code reader into the car and look at the live data. For some reason, the EGR_ERR value was still 99.2%, so I decided to try unplugging the EGR Valve connector, after it had warmed up and was juddering.

After unplugging it, car drove flawlessly, no issues whatsoever.

I am unsure as to why this is still happening as I replaced the EGR valve and gasket with a brand new unit. If anyone could shed light on this it'd be fantastic.

I'm planning on driving with it unplugged, although it occasionally flags up an EWL telling me "The exhaust gas recirculation performance is poor", and having to clear the codes on my car every trip would suck a bit.

I'm also aware that an alternative is to get it mapped out, but I'm unsure what the cost of that will be, nor the availability in the current year.

This, however, seems to be a temporary fix that works well enough.
 

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wow, awesome, must feel good when something finally works :D could you by any chance drop a photo on how you unplugged it ? as im really a noob in cars not gonna lie, I will show it to my mechanic when i get the chance I guess
 

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Good news! Last night I decided to plug my code reader into the car and look at the live data. For some reason, the EGR_ERR value was still 99.2%, so I decided to try unplugging the EGR Valve connector, after it had warmed up and was juddering.

After unplugging it, car drove flawlessly, no issues whatsoever.

I am unsure as to why this is still happening as I replaced the EGR valve and gasket with a brand new unit. If anyone could shed light on this it'd be fantastic.

I'm planning on driving with it unplugged, although it occasionally flags up an EWL telling me "The exhaust gas recirculation performance is poor", and having to clear the codes on my car every trip would suck a bit.

I'm also aware that an alternative is to get it mapped out, but I'm unsure what the cost of that will be, nor the availability in the current year.

This, however, seems to be a temporary fix that works well enough.
Just a thought, maybe the new EGR valve is also faulty, maybe worth returning it to where you bought it and getting them to check it and replace it if faulty. 馃憤
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
wow, awesome, must feel good when something finally works :D could you by any chance drop a photo on how you unplugged it ? as I'm really a noob in cars not gonna lie, I will show it to my mechanic when i get the chance I guess
Just raining at the moment, but I'll go and take a picture when it's cleared up. You shouldn't need a mechanic to do it, it's literally a single plug that takes 10 seconds, no more difficult than unplugging something from a socket in your house 馃槈.
 

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Discussion Starter · #38 ·
Just a thought, maybe the new EGR valve is also faulty, maybe worth returning it to where you bought it and getting them to check it and replace it if faulty. 馃憤
I bought my replacement from AUTODOC as they were stocking a brand new unit for the lowest price (Cox motors and Tegiwa didn't seem to stock it, and Euro Car parts wanted 拢250 for it, compared to the 拢70 from autodoc). I've contacted them regarding the issue, but I'm not hopeful I'll get anything useful from them. Might have to phone up the local Honda showroom's parts department to get one that's a bit more legit, although I'm not sure I'd like the price 馃槵馃槵.

If you're interested, I bought something similar to this https://www.autodoc.co.uk/ridex/8153111, as well as a new gasket, although they no longer list the exact one I purchased.

As always, I'll keep you updated 馃憤
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 ·
Got an update. Took the car for a cruise to run some errands, and the jerk is still present, but at sub 2k rpm and far less frequent, only when under extreme load.

An EWL came on reporting the engine running lean.

I'm maybe thinking that the cause of the judder is the MAF or the throttle body under reading, and not supplying enough fuel.

The only reason it's less frequent is due to the fuel that would normally be added for the exhaust gasses now combusting with the air.

Unplugging the EGR valve still makes it far better to drive, but I'm still planning to get it booked in at the dealership after my MOT.
 
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