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Discussion Starter #1
Got the toda manifold installed today, seems like the car's lost a bit of power/torque in the low rev range but gained a fair bit after 4k rpm, is that normal? Im pretty impressed with the gains on the manifold, car pulls really hard.

Another issue is after the manifold was installed there seems to be some knocking or rubbing below the footwell...not sure what it is...but I rechecked everything briefly and nothing seems to be loose, could it possibly be rubbing against the heat shield? Haven't seen it up on a hoist before so not sure how much clearance there actually is...the sound is intermittent and it is quite annoying...wondering if anyone knows what this might be related to?

And I was expecting to get a CEL, even after driving for approx 60kms still nothing, am I just lucky or is something wrong? I would expect the ecu to throw a CEL because of the non existence of a cat
 

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Got the toda manifold installed today, seems like the car's lost a bit of power/torque in the low rev range but gained a fair bit after 4k rpm, is that normal? Im pretty impressed with the gains on the manifold, car pulls really hard.

Another issue is after the manifold was installed there seems to be some knocking or rubbing below the footwell...not sure what it is...but I rechecked everything briefly and nothing seems to be loose, could it possibly be rubbing against the heat shield? Haven't seen it up on a hoist before so not sure how much clearance there actually is...the sound is intermittent and it is quite annoying...wondering if anyone knows what this might be related to?

And I was expecting to get a CEL, even after driving for approx 60kms still nothing, am I just lucky or is something wrong? I would expect the ecu to throw a CEL because of the non existence of a cat
You should have a FlashPro if you have installed the Toda exhaust manifold. If you are running with stock calibration then is normal that the car doesn't feel OK.

The Toda exhaust manifold fit 100% perfect, so if you hear some knocking or rubbing there should be something wrong with the installation (quite extrange because it's very easy to install).

You are not "lucky" about the CEL, you will have it in a few kilometers, it depends on your lambda sensor.
 

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Like gasss said, without a good remap, it is normal what you tell. Anyway, without any change in the ECU settings it still runs nice from mid to high revs.

Yes, I had the same noise from under the car. When I installed the manifold I saw that the secondaries of it where placed very close to the heat shield. I Had some runs and saw clearly that the heat shield was "touching" the manifold (...while running: "trinc-trinc-triiitriii-triiinc" sound...). I lifted the car, desinstalled the shield, cutted it, and ready. ;)

Install a CEL eliminator, mate. You will need it soon, or if you get the flashpro, you can set it up correctly.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Thanks gasss and waff, good info there! I suspected it was the heatshied rubbing against the manifold, I went under the car with it jacked up and had a look at the clearance and I couldn't even fit my finger between the heatshield and the manifold! it was about 3mm...i bent it out flat as possible and no sounds now :) I've been driving reasonably hard for over 100km now and still no CEL and surprisingly fuel consumption is better LOL! Something may be wrong with my sensor?

With flashpro, does it give any more highend power or is it mainly mid range? How much gain can be expected to have assuming I run it with the group n flash?
 

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To really see the gains your need to get it mapped. If mapped your see gains everywhere
 

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You disable the second oxyxen sensor, not the first.

The first sensor is a narrowband sensor that informs the ECU of oxygen readings, then the ECU works accordingly. This first one is located before the catalytic converter.
The second sensor, that is located after the cat. converter, also does oxygen readings, but these are used to know if cat. converter is working properly as well as helping the readings from the first sensor.

When you install a race manifold like the Toda, there is no converter. Then the second sensor reads aproximatelly the same than the first sensor. In this case ECU tables are compared and it detects cat. converter failure (ECU reads it like converter is damaged), injection is slightly changed and car performs wrong... it is matter of time...

Solutions:

A) Buy a simple CEL eliminator. Type it on google or check with some seller from this forum, I am sure TDI, CPL or others have it available.
This little and simple piece, is a threaded extension that you install in the secondary sensor bung (between the bung and the sensor). Once isntalled, it distorts the second readings. This deceives the ECU about converter status.

B) With Flashpro, you disable the second sensor. Once done, ECU doesn't need to know the status of the converter...



Yes, as TDI told you, you can expect gains in mid and top end with Flashpro.
With Hondata Group N you could expect small mid range gains more than high end, just with the manifold installed, I guess. You cannot know the exact numbers mate.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Thanks guys, very good info! Looks like I will need flashpro! I assume it is fairly easy to disable the sensor on flashpro? And do you guys with the toda manifold leave it de-cat or weld in a cat converter?
tdi-north you have pm :)
 

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Hehehe. No, no, mate. Leave it de-cat. ^^
If you cut and weld a cat. there, you are killing this nice manifold. :rolleyes:
 
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